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How to prevent Lyme disease this summer

news.harvard.edu

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Re: How to prevent Lyme disease this summer

#101
post #89
post #29

Earlier quoted context omitted.

In DE, we have “Zeckenrollen”. [1] They are filled with cotton material that mice will carry to their nest. And it’s treated with some tick killing substance. [1] https://zeckenrollen.de

Probably treated with permethrin. I've seen lots of guides about soaking cotton balls in permethrin and sticking them in cardboard tubes to place where mice might be nesting.

Great idea. Those Zeckenrollen are quite expensive, especially when you have a large area to cover.

Re: How to prevent Lyme disease this summer

#102
post #68
post #7

Just go to your PCP and get your one time course of 2 doxycycline pills as soon as you get bitten. I also spray my hiking/yardwork pants and boots with permethrin. DEET is pretty useless, I’ve seen them walk right over DEET sprayed boots onto my pants. They make it about 5 steps through permethrin. I’m surprised advise from Harvard is getting this wrong. If you want even more protection, you can buy stocking like sla…

After every bite? That is a manual how to breed multi resistant Borrelia burgdorferi, the short version. Please be a responsible human being and consult a doctor. Common symptoms for a bacterial infections are flu like symptoms and a bullseye-like rash a few days after the bite. Be on the lookout for those and you will be fine.

Unfortunately, these 'common symptoms' often do not occur after an infection, so this is misleading. In never had them but was positive for Lyme after dealing with joint pain for quite a while. Taking a single dose of Doxy is usually recommended if you live in an area with high prevalence of Lyme in ticks [1], and if the tick was not cleanly removed within 24h. The latest meta study I'm aware of showed that this will reduce the likelihood of infection by about 70% [2].

The fear of breeding a MR Borrelia is completely overblown. By far the highest risk of breeding MRSA are in a hospital setting, not by taking a single dose of Doxy at home. The main reason to not take Doxy is its side effects (for instance, when I had to take it against my Lyme infection, I vomited like there's no tomorrow, which fortunately is one of the lesser serious side effects. Had to switch to Amoxi.).

[1] https://www.cdc.gov/lyme/datasurveillance/lyme-disease-maps....

[2] https://bmcinfectdis.biomedcentral.com/articles/10.1186/s128...

Re: How to prevent Lyme disease this summer

#103
post #64

Earlier quoted context omitted.

"You have to tiptoe around their ego." Only if you have a shit doctor. I've had to be an advocate for medical care of family members, and I've had a few doctors actually compliment me on being an engaged advocate for their treatment. You still want to be respectful and open minded, but some basic study of the condition/treatment/lingo can go a long way to them seeing you as an informed patient they are willing to wor…

I agree about self/family advocacy, and for sure some of the doctors one gets are engaged and good. I think doctors generally become less shit as the stakes go up (end of life, pediatrics, emergency triage, etc). The problem is getting them to talk about anything proactively before you get to that point. My comment was more along the lines of if you know you need Doxycycline for a tick bite and they're holding off, y…

"eg the tick could have been on me all day"

Well, that's a problem. If it's only been one day, they aren't going to give it to you. It's only supposed to be past 72 hours. Of course they're not going to listen and they'll argue if you're pushing something beyond the guidelines. If you frame it differently, like you don't know if it's been on there for days, then they're more likely to work with you.

I've actually had a similar tick issue for a child. There was no way of knowing for sure how long it was attached until tested in the lab. The doctor was still willing to prescribe the doxycycline when we explained the situation. There's also a state lab that will test ticks and give a report on whether the tick tests positive for about a half dozen diseases and also tell you how long it was attached. The doctor's lab could only test the tick for Lyme. He was genuinely interested in learning about this other lab from me even though I was not a medical professional.

Re: How to prevent Lyme disease this summer

#104

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I agree about self/family advocacy, and for sure some of the doctors one gets are engaged and good. I think doctors generally become less shit as the stakes go up (end of life, pediatrics, emergency triage, etc). The problem is getting them to talk about anything proactively before you get to that point. My comment was more along the lines of if you know you need Doxycycline for a tick bite and they're holding off, y…

"eg the tick could have been on me all day" Well, that's a problem. If it's only been one day, they aren't going to give it to you. It's only supposed to be past 72 hours. Of course they're not going to listen and they'll argue if you're pushing something beyond the guidelines. If you frame it differently, like you don't know if it's been on there for days, then they're more likely to work with you. I've actually had…

My griping was more about the medical system in general. My one experience of going to the doctor for a tick was actually pretty good (my primary care doctor, who suffers from the standard push you out the door after 10 minutes and can't you go to the ER instead, but has otherwise been pretty agreeable). I think I told them I knew it was on me for at least 4 hours, but could have been 12, and they prescribed Doxycycline. So either the 72h guideline isn't standard, or there is room for judgement that makes sense to push for. Because personally, I'm not looking to gamble with long tail Lyme and I generally find length of time guidelines for stochastic events pretty uncompelling.

Re: How to prevent Lyme disease this summer

#105

Same story as a lot of people here. I got Lyme when I was in my early twenties. I had no bullseye rash and no evidence of a tick bite. And I lived in California which made it even more confusing. Woke up one day with debilitating headaches (I never got headaches normally). Lasted for two weeks, doctor said I had "viral meningitis" which should clear up on its own. Coincidentally they did, and thought all is well! Nex…

Thank you for sharing your experience. I wonder if there's a course for non-medical professionals about common symptoms and what to look out for. My high school didn't offer one.

Re: How to prevent Lyme disease this summer

#106

What sucks about Lyme disease are the possible long term effects that an infection can have. Some people believe it's because of bacteria that stay hidden in your body, but I think the more likely explanation is an auto-immune reaction. There is no treatment for these long term effects. (It's called "post treatment lyme disease syndrome").

it actually hides along the cell walls between movements. My mom had Lyme and I was born with it. at age 12 i saw on live video the Lyme in action.

I got rid of Lyme via eastern medicine and a liquid oxygen shot daily. Lyme hates oxygen rich environments

Re: How to prevent Lyme disease this summer

#108
post #68

Earlier quoted context omitted.

After every bite? That is a manual how to breed multi resistant Borrelia burgdorferi, the short version. Please be a responsible human being and consult a doctor. Common symptoms for a bacterial infections are flu like symptoms and a bullseye-like rash a few days after the bite. Be on the lookout for those and you will be fine.

Getting antibiotics maybe once a year is not excessive. Please stop being hyperbolic, I’m well aware of MRSAs and do my best to take them sparingly. Where I live between 50-70% of the deer ticks have Lyme disease so it’s not overkill.

This was in reference to after every bite, not once a year.

Antibiotic resistance is not hyperbole. It is a real problem, and potentially a big one. What would be hyperbolic is if the part of the world that lives in tick infested regions would be pretty much on a constant antibiotic binge during season.

A full dose is two weeks and you are likely to be bitten again. I don't know if the suggestion was in reference to ideas that float around the Internet that you shouldn't take the full two week dose, but none of those studies have been replicated. Given what we know from how antibiotic resistance forms, they could be potentially harmful.

Just be careful when taking medical advice.

Re: How to prevent Lyme disease this summer

#109

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Getting antibiotics maybe once a year is not excessive. Please stop being hyperbolic, I’m well aware of MRSAs and do my best to take them sparingly. Where I live between 50-70% of the deer ticks have Lyme disease so it’s not overkill.

This was in reference to after every bite, not once a year. Antibiotic resistance is not hyperbole. It is a real problem, and potentially a big one. What would be hyperbolic is if the part of the world that lives in tick infested regions would be pretty much on a constant antibiotic binge during season. A full dose is two weeks and you are likely to be bitten again. I don't know if the suggestion was in reference to…

Antibiotic resistance almost never occurs in isolated situations. It’s hospital settings and large factory farms that are the issue. Either ways there’s a Lyme vaccine on the way. It should be available by 2025.

Re: How to prevent Lyme disease this summer

#110
post #6

It says to use DEET? No. Use permethrin (on clothes) and picaridin (on self).

Yes to permethrin, but beware it’s very dangerous for cats. Don’t spray your clothes anywhere near them. Maybe keep any clothes you treat with it in a room they can’t reach, or sealed in a container—I think once it dries it’s less-dangerous but I still wouldn’t want one to decide to curl up on a pile of them.

Yeah I spray the clothes in the garage and let them fully dry out there. Everything I’ve read says once it’s dry there’s no issue, it’s only the liquid that’s dangerous for them.
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