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TSMC unveils 1.6nm process technology with backside power delivery

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Re: TSMC unveils 1.6nm process technology with backside power delivery

#21

Sounds like a response to Intel's 18A process [0], which is also coming in 2026. [0] https://www.tomshardware.com/tech-industry/manufacturing/int...

This is a response to something that’s coming in 2 years? Incredible how far ahead they are

This will also come in 2026, so not that far ahead.

Re: TSMC unveils 1.6nm process technology with backside power delivery

#23
post #12
post #8

>1.6nm Gotta love how we now have fractions of a near meaningless metric.

Why is it meaningless?

Because it lost meaning somewhere between a micron and 100nm.

From roughly the 1960s through the end of the 1990s, the number meant printed gate lengths or half-pitch (which were identical).

At some point, companies started using "equivalences" which became increasingly detached from reality. If my 50nm node had better performance than your 30nm node because I have FinFETs or SOI or whatever, shouldn't I call mine 30nm? But at that point, if you have something less than 30nm somewhere in your process, shouldn't you call it 20nm? And so the numbers detached from reality.

So now when you see a 1.6nm process, it's think "1.6nm class", rather than that corresponding to any specific feature size, and furthermore, understand that companies invent class number exaggerations differently. For example, an Intel 10nm roughly corresponds to Samsung / TSMC 7nm (and all would probably be around 15-30nm before equivalences).

That should give you enough for a web search if you want all the dirty details.

Re: TSMC unveils 1.6nm process technology with backside power delivery

#24
post #2

could someone ELi5 the backside power delivery please ?

Half your wires deliver power, half deliver signal. So if you do both on the same side, you need twice the density of wires. If you split the delivery into two parts, you get double the density without needing to make things smaller.

Re: TSMC unveils 1.6nm process technology with backside power delivery

#26
post #18

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Because it's not measuring anything, except the tech generation. It conveys about as much information as "iPhone 14".

It's at least more easily understandable (lower is newer) than the average tech product naming scheme, especially those by Microsoft.

The problem is it sounds like something any engineer can understand without domain knowledge, but interpreting it that way is completely wrong. The worst kind of naming. Not just IKEA-style random names (and I say that as a Swede,) but reusing a standard, while not keeping to what the standard is normally used for, and what it previously meant even in this domain.

N1.6 is much better for naming node processes. Or even TSMC16.

Re: TSMC unveils 1.6nm process technology with backside power delivery

#27
post #23
post #12

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Why is it meaningless?

Because it lost meaning somewhere between a micron and 100nm. From roughly the 1960s through the end of the 1990s, the number meant printed gate lengths or half-pitch (which were identical). At some point, companies started using "equivalences" which became increasingly detached from reality. If my 50nm node had better performance than your 30nm node because I have FinFETs or SOI or whatever, shouldn't I call mine 30…

The same thing happened with chip frequency around the end of the 1990s.

Chip frequencies stagnated (end of Dennard scaling if I remember correctly) giving the impression that single threaded performance had stagnated, but since then chip makers have used increasing data and instruction parallelism to squeeze even more apparent single threaded performance out of chips. A 3ghz chip today is usually way faster on average code than a 3ghz chip 15 years ago. They also started expanding into multiple cores and adding more cache of course.

For fab processes we should just switch to transistor density. That still wouldn't capture everything (e.g. power efficiency) but would be a lot better than not-actually-nanometers.

For performance we really don't have a good single metric anymore since all these performance hacks mean different levels of gain on different code.

Re: TSMC unveils 1.6nm process technology with backside power delivery

#28

Earlier quoted context omitted.

This is a response to something that’s coming in 2 years? Incredible how far ahead they are

This will also come in 2026, so not that far ahead.

Depends who will ultimately deliver.
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