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Biden signs TikTok bill into law, starting clock for ByteDance to divest

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Re: Biden signs TikTok bill into law, starting clock for ByteDance to divest

#431

Post by insane_dreamer »

seattle_spring wrote: post #44
jMyles wrote: post #27

Earlier quoted context omitted.

And yet, at least anecdotally, it is very widely used, along with virtually every other resource that that Chinese state regards as banned.

I think they meant the US domain tiktok.com is banned. TikTok itself is not banned in CN, and its web presence there is likely available at the respective CN domain. I’m guessing it’s tiktok.cn, but I’m not checking so I take no responsibility if it’s a phishing domain.

Tiktok is indeed banned in China.

Douyin is owned by the same company but not the same platform. It is subject to Chinese gov censorship (like all media in China), while Tiktok is not (therefore banned).

Re: Biden signs TikTok bill into law, starting clock for ByteDance to divest

#432

Post by Vegenoid »

danieltanfh95 wrote: post #301
returningfory2 wrote: post #38

The work "ban" is in scare quotes for a reason. The law doesn't ban TikTok. Rather, it bans TikTok from having Chinese owners. If the law stands, the end result will likely be that TikTok will be sold to US owners, rather than TikTok going away. It's surprising to me that this this pretty significant distinction has been glossed over both in media reporting and in general comments here on HN. To be clear, I'm not sup…

Just because it doesn’t say “ban” doesn’t mean its not one. It is well known that China lists algorithms and AI models trained on citizen data as a non-export so tiktok will never be able to sell to anyone other than a Chinese company unless they retrain the model etc. The CEO has mentioned that they will simply pull out of the US market.

Of course the CEO is going to say that, because they don't want the law passed. When the chips are down, it's a lot less likely that just pull out than that they take the money from one of the many salivating buyers.

Re: Biden signs TikTok bill into law, starting clock for ByteDance to divest

#433

Post by collegeburner »

ThinkBeat wrote: post #372

I hope this will show the severity of threats countries face from social media and that things are no longer business as usual. Every European country /and/or EU/ECC as a block, as well as every other nation or block, should follow this up as soon as permitted to have all social media apps operated by a foreign country be subject to the same legislation. TikTok will have to sel to the US, Netherlands, France, Germany…

No, small states do not have the same rights as large ones. You may disagree with this but I don't see any point in pretending it's untrue. Large countries have more sway and matter more to everyone, including but not limited to operators of social platforms. Losing half your userbase hurts much more than losing a hundredth. I also doubt that the U.S. would force a sale of a social app based in the Netherlands, France, Germany, Turkey, Gabon, Vietnam, Thailand, Mexico, Egypt etc etc etc.

I wouldn't particularly blame Gabon or Vietnam if they wanted their primary media outlets operated by nations that are at least vaguely friendly to their values. They are free to attempt to force a sale and ban it when those apps inevitably do not comply.

Re: Biden signs TikTok bill into law, starting clock for ByteDance to divest

#434

Post by insane_dreamer »

ok123456 wrote: post #60
dwnoble wrote: post #22

Fun fact: according to https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_websites_blocked_in_ma... , tiktok.com has been blocked in mainland China since 2020.

Shouldn't the US prove it's better than China by its self-consistent actions with its espoused virtues of freedom of the press?

Looks like the wumao's have made it to HN :)

Re: Biden signs TikTok bill into law, starting clock for ByteDance to divest

#435

Post by timerol »

nonethewiser wrote: post #308

Can someone explain why the previous "ban" was blocked but this wasnt? As I recall TikTok filed for an injunction and they argued it was unconstitutional (violated the 5th ammendment) and the injunction was granted. Then Biden rescinded the executive order and it ended there.

As I understand it, the unconstitutionality of the initial executive order was based on the balance of power in the US government. Doing this kind of thing by executive order is not allowed. Doing this kind of thing by passing a law through Congress is allowed. The Constitution gives a lot of power to the legislature, especially given the interpretations of the Commerce Clause over the history of the US.

Re: Biden signs TikTok bill into law, starting clock for ByteDance to divest

#436

Post by ok123456 »

insane_dreamer wrote: post #434
ok123456 wrote: post #60

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Shouldn't the US prove it's better than China by its self-consistent actions with its espoused virtues of freedom of the press?

Looks like the wumao's have made it to HN :)

who?

Re: Biden signs TikTok bill into law, starting clock for ByteDance to divest

#437

Post by josu »

paulddraper wrote: post #430
JumpCrisscross wrote: post #386

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> Twitter, Facebook, Instagram, Snapchat, YouTube, WhatsApp, will either have to stop operating outside of the Unites States or they will need to be sold to every country they wish to operate in TikTok can sell to a French, Hungarian, Indian, Brazilian or even Iraqi person and be in compliance with this bill's terms. It doesn't require American ownership, it forbids control by a foreign adversary. If the EU and U.S.…

Correct. Any other country on earth, other than: * China * North Korea * Iran * Cuba * Russia * Venezuela Could sell it to Pakistan, Syria, Yemen, Somalia, Afghanistan, Belarus, etc.

What about Hong Kong?

Re: Biden signs TikTok bill into law, starting clock for ByteDance to divest

#438

Post by insane_dreamer »

wumeow wrote: post #35

For everyone here having the vapours over this, note that the US government also prohibits more than 20/25% foreign ownership of radio/tv stations and airlines, and has for almost 100 years. It’s going to be ok.

Good point. I wonder how did Murdoch (Australian) end up owning Fox News?

Re: Biden signs TikTok bill into law, starting clock for ByteDance to divest

#440

Post by ok123456 »

mminer237 wrote: post #373
ok123456 wrote: post #60

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Shouldn't the US prove it's better than China by its self-consistent actions with its espoused virtues of freedom of the press?

The Bill of Rights does not inherently apply to non-citizens. There's nothing stopping the people from running TikTok without government oversight. The only problem is that a foreign adversary controls it. This really is not comparable to China's restrictions.

Yes, it does Yamataya v. Fisher and Yick Wo v. Hopkins. And that protection extends to commercial entities: First National Bank of Boston v. Bellotti.
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