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TikTok CEO expects to defeat US ban: 'We aren't going anywhere'

reuters.com

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Re: TikTok CEO expects to defeat US ban: 'We aren't going anywhere'

#31

Post by remarkEon »

nimbius wrote: post #27

If the US has any credibility in the context of its constitutional sanctity, then this "ban" will be declared unconstitutional by the us supreme court. if this were a poker game, ByteDance would have a full house. There is just no way they can lose this case, if only because the Citizens United ruling grants their corporation personhood.

USG has forced sales similar to this in previous years (Grindr), both without an act of Congress and without the lingering smell of national security concerns. This is different, yes, but different in that the legal case is more robust, not less.

Re: TikTok CEO expects to defeat US ban: 'We aren't going anywhere'

#32

Post by davis »

CrzyLngPwd wrote: post #12

Can anyone say what user data ByteDance might share with the Chinese government? Also, how is China an adversary? I thought the USA and China were trading partners.

We are trading partners for sure but the American model and Chinese model are fundamentally opposed. For the last 10-15 years, tensions have been getting hotter because Xi has been consolidating power and flexing his strength across the region and exporting censorship. You can look at Hong Kong as an example of this. It's clear China doesn't want to live under a Western hegemony and has been trying to get more power and the US sees this. Trump instituted tariffs and we've also banned Huawei 5G equipment and it's all in the interest of national security and China hasn't liked this. So things have been going back and forth. TikTok is just seen as a scary possibility in that they could influence American minds at a scale that is unprecedented. There's a law in the US that no foreign entity can own a large share of any US broadcasting company. This is just to prevent hostile takeovers and controlling media. This is pretty similar to that in that TikTok is a media company and the US wants to exert that same control. User data is a red herring and honestly the least of the concern if you think about the soft power they control with the TikTok algorithm. Even though we have a trading relationship, things have been heating up under the surface for decades.

Re: TikTok CEO expects to defeat US ban: 'We aren't going anywhere'

#33

Post by JumpCrisscross »

SteveNuts wrote: post #15
gjsman-1000 wrote: post #8

Does he seriously think the US SCOTUS is going to override the will of 79 senators, for the sake of a company with documented ties to the Chinese Communist Party? If I was a senator, I would consider that almost treasonous. Frankly, even if you disagree with the vote, a democracy can and should be able to make such judgement calls. At that rate, the CCP should be able to buy beachfront property in California, ship mi…

> Frankly, even if you disagree with the vote, a democracy can and should be able to make such judgement calls That's literally SCOTUS's job though, particularly as it relates to the US Constitution. The whole point is that unconstitutional laws "in theory" should be struck down.

> That's literally SCOTUS's job

Its job is to resolve cases and controversies. If that requires finding the Constitution supersedes a law (or a federal law supersedes a state law), so be it.

Re: TikTok CEO expects to defeat US ban: 'We aren't going anywhere'

#34

Post by UncleOxidant »

10000truths wrote: post #7
m3kw9 wrote: post #6

Why not restrict it everything to be local server and have IT monitor and restrict traffic outside the country

They're already doing that with Project Texas. Oracle is the "IT".

I recall that this was the compromise they made when Trump wanted to ban TT. Did this not address the security concerns?

Re: TikTok CEO expects to defeat US ban: 'We aren't going anywhere'

#35

Post by Jezebelley »

jauntywundrkind wrote: post #18

I kind of low key look forward to this. It's hard for me to imagine TikTok retaining even 20% of the US market share after an app store ban. But that 20% would still be a huge cultural victory for ByteDance, would be an impressive resistance. The US would really have to turn into a monster, would have to deputize a huge amount of internet services into becoming policemen to go further, and that's a horrible thing tha…

If it's banned it'll all but die out of American popular culture. People will shift to things like YouTube Shorts instead. You can't even get the average person to understand mastodon let alone buy into a VPN subscription to circumvent regional bans.

Re: TikTok CEO expects to defeat US ban: 'We aren't going anywhere'

#36

Post by slowmovintarget »

jauntywundrkind wrote: post #18

I kind of low key look forward to this. It's hard for me to imagine TikTok retaining even 20% of the US market share after an app store ban. But that 20% would still be a huge cultural victory for ByteDance, would be an impressive resistance. The US would really have to turn into a monster, would have to deputize a huge amount of internet services into becoming policemen to go further, and that's a horrible thing tha…

Meanwhile, China orders Apple to yank WhatsApp and Facebook apps from its app store in China, because, ya know... they can.

Re: TikTok CEO expects to defeat US ban: 'We aren't going anywhere'

#38

Post by SteveNuts »

JumpCrisscross wrote: post #33
SteveNuts wrote: post #15

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> Frankly, even if you disagree with the vote, a democracy can and should be able to make such judgement calls That's literally SCOTUS's job though, particularly as it relates to the US Constitution. The whole point is that unconstitutional laws "in theory" should be struck down.

> That's literally SCOTUS's job Its job is to resolve cases and controversies. If that requires finding the Constitution supersedes a law (or a federal law supersedes a state law), so be it.

Right - so the question is: should the Senate be able to pass any law, no matter what, because it was overwhelmingly voted for? To me the "overwhelmingly voted for" criteria is not enough. Why would we even need a Supreme Court in that case? Just let the legislative branch do whatever it wants as long as most vote in favor.

Re: TikTok CEO expects to defeat US ban: 'We aren't going anywhere'

#39

Post by silverquiet »

gjsman-1000 wrote: post #29
ceejayoz wrote: post #16

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> If I was a senator, I would consider that almost treasonous. The Constitution - in this case, probably the First Amendment - very clearly limits what the Senate can do. The entire three-branch system is built on checks and balances of this nature. > Frankly, even if you disagree with the vote, a democracy can and should be able to make such judgement calls. Can we vote to put redheads in extermination camps?

Determining whether to allow a business incorporated offshore to operate in our country is completely incomparable to a inherited permanent genetic trait.

I won't be intentionally obtuse, but I was under the impression that basically all large tech companies are incorporated offshore. We think of them as American certainly, but when it comes time to pay taxes, I get the feeling they don't exude patriotic enthusiasm to do so. I'm quite sure that they feel much more allegiance to shareholders wherever they might be in the world than they do for Americans as a group.

Re: TikTok CEO expects to defeat US ban: 'We aren't going anywhere'

#40

Post by ceejayoz »

gjsman-1000 wrote: post #29
ceejayoz wrote: post #16

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> If I was a senator, I would consider that almost treasonous. The Constitution - in this case, probably the First Amendment - very clearly limits what the Senate can do. The entire three-branch system is built on checks and balances of this nature. > Frankly, even if you disagree with the vote, a democracy can and should be able to make such judgement calls. Can we vote to put redheads in extermination camps?

Determining whether to allow a business incorporated offshore to operate in our country is completely incomparable to a inherited permanent genetic trait.

1. That's completely missing the point. The will of the Senate isn't the only thing that matters in our system, as it has concrete protections even for minority rights (for example, free speech for Nazis, as distasteful as it is to most of us) that cannot be overridden by mere legislative fiat, and thank goodness for that.

2. This bill, among other things, tells American private companies they must censor their app stores by excluding a particular application. It is, inherently, an act of censorship, and I think there's a good chance it doesn't survive court review. At the very least, it'll be years of litigation.

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