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Biden signs TikTok bill into law, starting clock for ByteDance to divest

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Re: Biden signs TikTok bill into law, starting clock for ByteDance to divest

#221

Post by Buttons840 »

ipaddr wrote: post #168
nme01 wrote: post #124

This shows that values such as “freedom of speech” are only key words used to enforce US policy in other countries. For such a long time it was advocated that free speech is an important thing and good in and on itself. Now it turns out the free speech is good only as long as it’s US who dominates the information market.

Freedom of speech is right for an American citizen not a foreign country or entity. Regardless free speech for Americans is already dead. Remember when they took away rights from groups you didn't care about? Now it's your turn.

Freedom of speech is a moral ideal that exists despite the intricacies of US law.

Re: Biden signs TikTok bill into law, starting clock for ByteDance to divest

#223

Post by LordKeren »

lispisok wrote: post #4

Maybe I'm ignorant but can somebody explain to me how the federal government can just ban TikTok? If I create an app or business can the feds just decide to ban it and it's over?

Unequivocally yes. The legislature of the United States government can pass a bill to ban your business.

This is also overwhelmingly likely to go unchallenged by the court system due to the provision being passed with overwhelming bipartisan support.

Re: Biden signs TikTok bill into law, starting clock for ByteDance to divest

#224

Post by fauigerzigerk »

nickthegreek wrote: post #51
returningfory2 wrote: post #38

The work "ban" is in scare quotes for a reason. The law doesn't ban TikTok. Rather, it bans TikTok from having Chinese owners. If the law stands, the end result will likely be that TikTok will be sold to US owners, rather than TikTok going away. It's surprising to me that this this pretty significant distinction has been glossed over both in media reporting and in general comments here on HN. To be clear, I'm not sup…

While I get the point... if the EU said Facebook could not be available in the Country unless the company divested from US interest, would we not call it a ban?

I think it matters whether it really is a ban or just called a ban, because the whole First Amendment argument hinges on this question.

If TikTok was banned in the sense that it had to shut down then the First Amendment argument could work. But if it's just a forced sale then it has no bearing on the freedom of speech of TokTok users.

Re: Biden signs TikTok bill into law, starting clock for ByteDance to divest

#225

Post by deepfriedbits »

JumpCrisscross wrote: post #188
deepfriedbits wrote: post #175

Why target TikTok only? They should ban any Chinese social media app or network, and that should remain in effect until China agrees to open its domestic audience to Instagram, Google, Facebook, X, etc.

> should ban any Chinese social media app or network The law permits the President to similarly designate any entity that meets the law's thresholds for a covered company [1] controlled by a foreign adversary [2]. [1] https://www.congress.gov/bill/118th-congress/house-bill/7521... § 2(g)(2) [2] Id. § 2(g)(1)

Thanks for highlighting the language. I fear it's not being framed as that, though, and there will be another battle in the court of public opinion for the next TikTok.

Re: Biden signs TikTok bill into law, starting clock for ByteDance to divest

#226

Post by JumpCrisscross »

mamonster wrote: post #219
JumpCrisscross wrote: post #160

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> If I were Bytedance I would cut off the US This is economically irrational to the tune of tens of billions of dollars. If Beijing truly does this, it somewhat cements the argument that TikTok was a CCP policy tool.

Depends. If you model this as a reputation game, depending on who is the sane and who is the crazy sender, the PBE might might be a pooling equilibrium(i.e makes sense to build the reputation of being a predatory firm).

> makes sense to build the reputation of being a predatory firm

To what end? It isn't going to placate the hawks in America. And it's likely to inflame them elsewhere, e.g. in Europe. The only way you can position it as a win is within China's domestic politics, where it would save face for Xi and his acolytes. (Hence, the inefficiency of dictatorship.)

Re: Biden signs TikTok bill into law, starting clock for ByteDance to divest

#227

Post by duxup »

bink wrote: post #140
duxup wrote: post #113

I'm not opposed. Granted my basis would be that China effectively bans such social media apps from the outside ... I'm ok with doing the same for them.

I should hope we hold ourselves to a higher bar than China. This would effectively set the precedent that the US Congress can choose winners and losers in the market and even force a sale of a foreign company to an American company. That's the type of action taken by Russia and China that is rightfully condemned. I'd prefer if we focused on why the app is dangerous and maybe pass some comprehensive privacy or anti-mo…

No my reasoning would simply be applying the same rules that China applies to US companies for social media.

Good for the goose…

Re: Biden signs TikTok bill into law, starting clock for ByteDance to divest

#228

Post by ok123456 »

j0ba wrote: post #187
ok123456 wrote: post #60

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Shouldn't the US prove it's better than China by its self-consistent actions with its espoused virtues of freedom of the press?

Please, US doesn't need to prove anything w.r.t freedom vs. China.

Actually, it does.

Re: Biden signs TikTok bill into law, starting clock for ByteDance to divest

#229

Post by wilsonnb3 »

hobotime wrote: post #134

TikTok made the mistake of making life difficult for the party. Boosting pro-Palestine voices has consequences.

The idea of banning Tik Tok or forcing Bytedance to sell it has been cooking for much longer than the current Israel-Palestine drama, it would have happened anyways

Re: Biden signs TikTok bill into law, starting clock for ByteDance to divest

#230

Post by LordKeren »

cljacoby wrote: post #99

As I understand the bill is solely focused with the national security implications of ByteDance being China-based, and not the social impacts of short form video platforms on mental health, attention span, etc. Good news for Instagram Reels. I also wonder if this goes through, does this set a precedent for enforcing similar divestment expectations for any companies operating in China. Is this isolated to social media…

The government already forced Grindr to be sold back in 2019 , so this isn’t a new precedent.

The only difference is scale and user base — and this time around it was even included in a bill.

The Government has a long history of interfering with foreign businesses in the name of national security. Feds have blocked sale of infrastructure like ports many times

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