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Our biggest ever river catch?

theoceancleanup.com

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Re: Our biggest ever river catch?

#121

Post by dgroshev »

missedthecue wrote: post #81
stevage wrote: post #77

Earlier quoted context omitted.

What do you mean it is a carbon sink? Extracting oil from underground then turning it into plastic above ground? Or do you mean something different?

Basically yes. Petroleum burned produces CO2. Petroleum plasticized does not. The more market share that plastic packaging eats up, the lower emissions are.

Only if plastic packaging ends up in a landfill, if we burn it we still release the carbon into the atmosphere. "Bioplastics" (ie made from atmospheric carbon captured by plants) are a better example, and if we landfill those they're a true carbon sink.

Re: Our biggest ever river catch?

#122

Post by Nextgrid »

martyvis wrote: post #113
amatecha wrote: post #73

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The western mind can definitely comprehend it. When it's garbage pickup day in my city, sometimes people are going by on bicycles rooting through trash bins (or recycling bins if it's recycling pickup day) and taking anything they can turn in for a recycling deposit. This is in Vancouver, Canada. It's probably not nearly as prevalent as in Colombia, but yeah... And yes, for sure, the root cause is the creation of pla…

The point of more resilient bags is you take them back with you. Both of our cars has a cooler bag with a bunch of regular bags to get packed at the Supermarket. You just have to remind yourself to bring them in with you.

The reusable bag idea only really works for car owners where you can keep a bag stash or intentional, stand-alone grocery runs where you can take bags from your house ahead of time.

If you're just walking back home from some unrelated task and want to grab some groceries you will rarely have a bag on you, so you'll end up buying one anyway, it'll be then collecting dust at home for months before eventually being thrown away.

Re: Our biggest ever river catch?

#123

Post by shuvuvt5 »

8f2ab37a-ed6c wrote: post #94
pentae wrote: post #82

A commendable operation but sadly, this is a very small fraction of a percentage of the 8-10 million tons of plastic entering the ocean each year. The Ocean Cleanup themselves have estimated at least 75% of ocean trash is from fishing boats, and from living on a remote tropical island myself, at least 90% of the things you find washed up on the beach appear to be from Chinese fishing vessels. (there's usually Chinese…

I’m glad I’m doing my part one straw at a time /s

Those straws aren't even paper and theyre full of forever chemicals.

Re: Our biggest ever river catch?

#124

Post by doubloon »

pentae wrote: post #82

A commendable operation but sadly, this is a very small fraction of a percentage of the 8-10 million tons of plastic entering the ocean each year. The Ocean Cleanup themselves have estimated at least 75% of ocean trash is from fishing boats, and from living on a remote tropical island myself, at least 90% of the things you find washed up on the beach appear to be from Chinese fishing vessels. (there's usually Chinese…

China is just adopting western ideas. Socialize the cost and privatize the profit. The western solution which is to make criminals of business people doesnt work well enough. Epa superfund sites go unfixed for decades. Governments should just print money and hire cleanup companies. Its like a massive jobs program for when AI takes normal jobs.

Re: Our biggest ever river catch?

#125

Post by dav43 »

antupis wrote: post #92
dav43 wrote: post #56

Why can’t we just start charging producers of waste a direct cost. If we charged producers (McDonald’s, coke, Pepsi, supermarket, uniliver etc) $1 for every plastic bottle they used, we’d have a budget for clean up and a change in motivations. Suddenly glass reuse programs are suddenly cost comparable etc

Because plastic from McDonald's is not that big a problem. Fishing gear https://www.theguardian.com/environment/2022/nov/07/invisibl... and carbon fibers are much bigger https://www.sciencedaily.com/releases/2023/07/230703133034.h... plastic polluters.

Same theory would apply - charge the producers of these products a cost - no matter a plastic bottle, a plastic nappy or a plastic medical device.

Re: Our biggest ever river catch?

#126

Post by schiffern »

Nextgrid wrote: post #122
martyvis wrote: post #113

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The point of more resilient bags is you take them back with you. Both of our cars has a cooler bag with a bunch of regular bags to get packed at the Supermarket. You just have to remind yourself to bring them in with you.

The reusable bag idea only really works for car owners where you can keep a bag stash or intentional, stand-alone grocery runs where you can take bags from your house ahead of time. If you're just walking back home from some unrelated task and want to grab some groceries you will rarely have a bag on you, so you'll end up buying one anyway, it'll be then collecting dust at home for months before eventually being thro…

They do have tiny reusable bags that can go in a day-bag or pocket. Surprisingly handy for random things.

eg https://www.amazon.com/dp/B07TT5VH1V/

Re: Our biggest ever river catch?

#127

Post by codingdave »

JoeAltmaier wrote: post #28
buovjaga wrote: post #14

Earlier quoted context omitted.

They're still working on open oceans: https://theoceancleanup.com/oceans/

This river cleanup is brilliant and effective. Messing with the top meter of ocean water does its own kind of damage. So much of the life in the ocean surface layer is going to be involved with the floating trash, like it or not. Ocean surface sterilization seems incautious and worrisome. Never mind we don't like to see trash. Stripping the ocean surface water will have unforeseen consequences.

How did you jump from cleanup to sterilization?

You do have a point that the impact on the ecosystem is a concern worth exploring, but your statement goes off the rails from there and assumes that they are sterilizing the ocean surface? You've got to expect pushback on such a leap unless you justify it.

Re: Our biggest ever river catch?

#128

Post by liotier »

missedthecue wrote: post #76
dav43 wrote: post #56

Why can’t we just start charging producers of waste a direct cost. If we charged producers (McDonald’s, coke, Pepsi, supermarket, uniliver etc) $1 for every plastic bottle they used, we’d have a budget for clean up and a change in motivations. Suddenly glass reuse programs are suddenly cost comparable etc

Plastic is very good for the environment relatively speaking. - It's a carbon sink, - it's lightweight (reducing transport emissions) - it takes very little energy to produce compared to glass or metals which require furnaces - and has very little carbon emissions during production unlike paper packaging which has a huge carbon footprint. The only problem with plastic is that it doesn't always make it to the proper d…

Plastics erode and degrade into microplastics, that get into the food chain... A carbon sink of sorts, but I would do without it.

Re: Our biggest ever river catch?

#129

Post by dotancohen »

missedthecue wrote: post #81
stevage wrote: post #77

Earlier quoted context omitted.

What do you mean it is a carbon sink? Extracting oil from underground then turning it into plastic above ground? Or do you mean something different?

Basically yes. Petroleum burned produces CO2. Petroleum plasticized does not. The more market share that plastic packaging eats up, the lower emissions are.

But what happens to that carbon when the plastic decomposes, biodegrades, burns, is digested, or meets any other end? That once-below-ground carbon is now in the atmosphere, whether it takes a year or a decade to break down.

Re: Our biggest ever river catch?

#130

Post by wil421 »

dav43 wrote: post #56

Why can’t we just start charging producers of waste a direct cost. If we charged producers (McDonald’s, coke, Pepsi, supermarket, uniliver etc) $1 for every plastic bottle they used, we’d have a budget for clean up and a change in motivations. Suddenly glass reuse programs are suddenly cost comparable etc

The problem is that countries lack basic infrastructure such as sanitation. People and illegal dump trucks throw trash into the rivers or right beside it.

If the companies are making recyclable products then the problem is disposal. There are lots of glass bottles products solid in Latin America like coke that’s put directly into a bag and the store keeps the glass for a refund. It’s easier to put an incentive on the collection of the bottle.

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