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Valkey Is Rapidly Overtaking Redis

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Re: Valkey Is Rapidly Overtaking Redis

#71

Post by iczero »

renewiltord wrote: post #39

It's too dangerous to build a company around open source. You're trapped between AWS eating you or having to relicense and AWS eating you. Source-available from the beginning protects you from this. The problem with OSS stuff is that people are generally price-sensitive and you can't beat the platforms for this since they get the R&D for free. It's sort of how I don't hire junior people. When others have trained them…

> It's too dangerous to build a company around open source.

You could always just like, not do that? There is nothing preventing anyone from simply not open-sourcing their software. Complaining that "people can use your open source software" is like complaining about how trees split water

Re: Valkey Is Rapidly Overtaking Redis

#72

Post by KronisLV »

skybrian wrote: post #55
paxys wrote: post #2

Good. I hope Redis Labs dies a slow death for stealing the project from the community.

Nothing was stolen. The license allows commercial forks. Also, nothing of value was lost. The new forks have all the source code.

> Also, nothing of value was lost. The new forks have all the source code.

What about the community fragmentation and the eventual rise of incompatibilities as the development will take on slightly different directions? E.g. what happened with MySQL and MariaDB.

Re: Valkey Is Rapidly Overtaking Redis

#73

Post by Alifatisk »

rcconf wrote: post #22

Redis holds such a special place in my heart. It was the definition of awesome, open-source software. It always felt like Redis was THE definition of open source. The fact that the license has changed is heart-breaking.

It’s a understandable move, it’s the same reason as Elastic. AWS and other hosting companies ate their lunch, of course they want a piece of the pie to stay alive.

That’s my take away from this anyway!

Re: Valkey Is Rapidly Overtaking Redis

#74

Post by Kwpolska »

Alifatisk wrote: post #73
rcconf wrote: post #22

Redis holds such a special place in my heart. It was the definition of awesome, open-source software. It always felt like Redis was THE definition of open source. The fact that the license has changed is heart-breaking.

It’s a understandable move, it’s the same reason as Elastic. AWS and other hosting companies ate their lunch, of course they want a piece of the pie to stay alive. That’s my take away from this anyway!

Even if there was no AWS product for managed Redis, how many businesses would bother paying Redis Labs and introducing extra latency to their cache server if they could easily set up their own instance on AWS (in EC2/ECS)? Configuring Redis is not rocket science.

Re: Valkey Is Rapidly Overtaking Redis

#75

Post by Macha »

renewiltord wrote: post #39

It's too dangerous to build a company around open source. You're trapped between AWS eating you or having to relicense and AWS eating you. Source-available from the beginning protects you from this. The problem with OSS stuff is that people are generally price-sensitive and you can't beat the platforms for this since they get the R&D for free. It's sort of how I don't hire junior people. When others have trained them…

The reality is we've seen very few source available projects take off, and it's likely that we'd all be using a competitor if Redis had started source available from the beginning.

Re: Valkey Is Rapidly Overtaking Redis

#76

Post by andix »

madeofpalk wrote: post #47
andix wrote: post #33

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I would personally never contribute to a project with non-free license without getting paid. It's basically working for a company without pay.

I would never contribute to commercially backed, freely licensed project unless I was being paid. Saying this as a developer who is paid for exactly that, not it any inside knowledge that points to ulterior motives, but just the idea of giving a company free labour is unsettling.

> I would never contribute to commercially backed, freely licensed project unless I was being paid.

I understand that position, but I think it depends on a few more factors.

Re: Valkey Is Rapidly Overtaking Redis

#77

Post by andix »

skybrian wrote: post #54
wmf wrote: post #37

Earlier quoted context omitted.

There are ways to prevent that which in retrospect we should have paid more attention to. For example, (L)GPL with no CLA cannot be changed later.

antirez wanted to allow it, not prevent it: https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=39863371

Thanks, that's a perfect summary of the problem and the reasons why the BSD license was picked. It's perfectly fine though to disagree and do it differently.

Re: Valkey Is Rapidly Overtaking Redis

#78

Post by madeofpalk »

anacrolix wrote: post #60
madeofpalk wrote: post #47

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I would never contribute to commercially backed, freely licensed project unless I was being paid. Saying this as a developer who is paid for exactly that, not it any inside knowledge that points to ulterior motives, but just the idea of giving a company free labour is unsettling.

Like the Go project?

Of course "it depends", and people should make their own mind up with what they're comfortable with.

Google doesn't monetise Go, so I would have less problems contributing to it. Redis, before the license change, is a perfect example of what I wouldn't contribute to.

Re: Valkey Is Rapidly Overtaking Redis

#80

Post by btilly »

Macha wrote: post #49
btilly wrote: post #44

Earlier quoted context omitted.

In retrospect, Redis Labs is about to learn a lesson that many have learned before. Community willingness to maintain popular software under the old license means that attempting to make free non-free will result in a fork taking over. As a prior example look at what happened a few years back when Oracle tried to make Hudson non-free. Now nobody has heard of Hudson, but everybody uses Jenkins. Which name was chosen f…

Was Jenkins a Leeroy Jenkins reference? Seemed to be just continuing the butler theme from Hudson.

It served as both, but at the time I definitely saw people referring to it as a Leeroy Jenkins reference. With the fact that can also refer to a butler as a bonus. Though I'm sure some saw it the other way.

It's a kind of pun that programmers like. For example when I asked, Larry Wall said that he named Perl, Perl after he had two acronyms. Namely Practical Extraction and Reporting Language and Perfectly Eclectic Rubbish Lister.

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