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GTar: The First Guitar That Anybody Can Play

kickstarter.com

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Re: GTar: The First Guitar That Anybody Can Play

#91
From the pictures, it looks like each fret is separated into six pieces, one for each string.

Presumably, this is how it tells which note you are playing. Pressing a string to the fret completes an electrical circuit. At first I thought the bridge had optical pickups based on the way it looked, but according to the description, the thing has no pickups.

There are some serious flaws with this design.

1) It looks like you can't bend strings, because the frets are divided into six segments. The string would get caught between the segments. If there's some kind of non-conductive bridge between the segments (unlikely), then it will probably wear differently. If you can't do a whole-step bend, then there's an enormous volume of music you can't play.

2) It's going to sound like trash. Without pickups, it has to synthesize the sound. I've gotten usable sampled guitar tracks before, but I did that by recording samples specifically for the song and manually tweaking each note.

3) It's unnecessary. You could basically take a stock Stratocaster, add a hex pickup and a LED neck, and you're done. The LED neck isn't easy, and of course it won't sound like a normal neck, but whatever. The guitar will still be a normal usable guitar.

If you want to divide guitar players into rhythm/lead and acoustic/electric, it becomes clear that this is a usable instrument in none of these four categories. Electric rhythm guitar strongly relies on palm-muting technique which you won't be able to learn without regular pickups. For electric lead, you need the whole-note bend and left-hand vibrato technique. The bend is impossible and the vibrato can't be taught without the pickup. Acoustic players want to be able to play and hang out with friends but the synth is just going to get in the way. You see the picture of that guy at the park with three friends (of course the two sitting next to him are girls)? He would probably be happier with an acoustic. Furthermore, if you learn on this guitar you'll be fairly hopeless on an acoustic since the strings are heavier (if you play electric and switch to acoustic, your left hand will give out fairly quick).

Incidentally, I paid about $330 for my first guitar, a Fender Stratocaster, plus amp. It's more like $400 with inflation since 2003. Never had lessons but it sure ain't hard to figure out "Smoke on the Water" or "Smells Like Teen Spirit".

Re: GTar: The First Guitar That Anybody Can Play

#93

Earlier quoted context omitted.

This was my first reaction, then I realized that for people who are trying to teach themselves guitar, this would be way easier than learning to read tablature, and even easier than watching youtube videos (since the mirror effect can be tricky at first). On the other hand, you risk becoming a guitarist who struggles to read tablature or learn by watching other guitarists, so the trade off is arguably high. At the ve…

For learning individual songs, learning to read real music would be an improvement over tabs. The problem with arguing that the GTar is easy for learning songs (and it is) is how much information is lost. Sheet music contains a ridiculous amount of information. Tablature does not. Lights on a wooden stick contain even less. At what point are you doing a disservice to the aspiring guitarist by taking away information?

It depends really. For someone learning an instrument for the first time, reading music isn't the problem - guitar tabs are really easy to read anyway. The issue is learning to co-ordinate hand and finger movements.

Once you're more comfortable playing the guitar, you can move onto more complex things like reading sheet music, or composing, or whatever tickles your fancy.

Think of it like programming: we recommend beginners start on languages like Python, Basic or Pascal to ease the mind into that way of working.

Re: GTar: The First Guitar That Anybody Can Play

#94
post #67

This is a cool idea, but I'm skeptical about it being worthwhile for the majority of people. There's absolutely no new ideas here, or anything that hasn't been done before. It's just a slightly novel combination of them. The "lights on the fretboard that show you what to play" thing has been done; and while it generally gets good reviews I don't think it's revolutionizing learning guitar or anything. Likewise pluggin…

I agree. Leaning over and looking at the fretboard puts you in a really bad position.

Re: GTar: The First Guitar That Anybody Can Play

#95
I really don't like it at all! Don't get me wrong, as an engineer I think it's a very exciting project. But as a guitarist, who spends a lot of time teaching others how to play, I could not think of a more misguided idea of what the instrument is about.

gTar works on the assumption that playing the guitar consists of putting your finger on the right fret at the right time. Imho this is as wrong as assuming that programming consists of pressing the correct keys in the right order. (million dollar idea: Teach you programming by putting LEDs on your keyboard! $599 only).

There's a common misconception that learning to play the guitar consists of learning where to press; after all, isn't this what tablatures are all about? I tend to put much more emphasis and practice on right-hand techniques. Other comments in this thread speak of 'early reward' or fast gratification; stubbornly trying to bend your left hand in unintuitive positions while your right hand cannot cope is NOT the answer.

Side-note for beginners wanting to learn the guitar: Learn a few chords you don't need a lot of them, then practice right-handed techniques (you can find plenty of examples off Youtube) religiously. Early mastery of this would rapidly give you comfort around the body. You can then get your gTar, read your tabs, or do things correctly by watching videos of your favorite artists and learn slowly to reproduce their songs.

Again, the engineer in me thinks this is an amazing project. However I would never recommend it as a guitar teaching tool.

Re: GTar: The First Guitar That Anybody Can Play

#96
post #7

As a guitarist, I don't think this is a useless tool for people learning how to play, but "the first guitar that anybody can play" is a ridiculous title. Anyone with two working hands and no cognitive disabilities can learn how to play a guitar already. It takes effort, but if you keep at it, learning how to play is inevitable. What they are promising with the title is that this device will take all the effort out of…

I'm also a guitarist and at first I agreed with your sentiment, but then I realized: it's a toy. Forget the positioning as a guitar learning tool, it's not a guitar. It's advanced-guitarhero for your iphone.

Re: GTar: The First Guitar That Anybody Can Play

#97
post #7

As a guitarist, I don't think this is a useless tool for people learning how to play, but "the first guitar that anybody can play" is a ridiculous title. Anyone with two working hands and no cognitive disabilities can learn how to play a guitar already. It takes effort, but if you keep at it, learning how to play is inevitable. What they are promising with the title is that this device will take all the effort out of…

I'm also a guitarist and at first I agreed with your sentiment, but then I realized: it's a toy. Forget the positioning as a guitar learning tool, it's not a guitar. It's advanced-guitarhero for your iphone.

And you might as well buy a YouRock for way less, even if you get the MadCatz MIDI adapter to play Rock Band in Pro mode.

Re: GTar: The First Guitar That Anybody Can Play

#98

Earlier quoted context omitted.

This was my first reaction, then I realized that for people who are trying to teach themselves guitar, this would be way easier than learning to read tablature, and even easier than watching youtube videos (since the mirror effect can be tricky at first). On the other hand, you risk becoming a guitarist who struggles to read tablature or learn by watching other guitarists, so the trade off is arguably high. At the ve…

For learning individual songs, learning to read real music would be an improvement over tabs. The problem with arguing that the GTar is easy for learning songs (and it is) is how much information is lost. Sheet music contains a ridiculous amount of information. Tablature does not. Lights on a wooden stick contain even less. At what point are you doing a disservice to the aspiring guitarist by taking away information?

I disagree with you on sheet music vs tab. GOOD tab is more informative than sheet music. Specifying which string to play a note on isn't something sheet music is very good at, and from a tonal perspective, it _matters_. A 4th string 5th fret "A" on a bass is VERY different from the same note played on an open 3rd string, for instance.

Re: GTar: The First Guitar That Anybody Can Play

#99
post #98

Earlier quoted context omitted.

For learning individual songs, learning to read real music would be an improvement over tabs. The problem with arguing that the GTar is easy for learning songs (and it is) is how much information is lost. Sheet music contains a ridiculous amount of information. Tablature does not. Lights on a wooden stick contain even less. At what point are you doing a disservice to the aspiring guitarist by taking away information?

I disagree with you on sheet music vs tab. GOOD tab is more informative than sheet music. Specifying which string to play a note on isn't something sheet music is very good at, and from a tonal perspective, it _matters_. A 4th string 5th fret "A" on a bass is VERY different from the same note played on an open 3rd string, for instance.

You're clearly not familiar with actual guitar sheet music. There's a lot of notational conventions for string indications. Along with fingerings, positions, barres, etc.

Re: GTar: The First Guitar That Anybody Can Play

#100
post #14

The thing that gets me about a lot of these products being built around the iPhone, iPod, etc... is what happens if the next generation changes the physical form factor? It may mean getting a new iPhone also means having to replace 10 other gadgets you have come to enjoy. Edit: looking closer this one does seem to have a module the phone sits in so it may be future upgradable however... you still require the upgrade,…

We literally got buried by all of the outreach and attention due to layering the Disrupt / Kickstarter launch, so sorry about the crazy delay...

The dock is removable, you can pop it out using a flat head screw driver pretty quickly. There's a cavity in the body and we're actually making a small change to the design of how the electronics are integrated into the dock itself instead of the underlying assembly so that if the 30 pin changes we can adapt to it. Another benefit is that through a generic expansion port we could also support other phones / devices.

The ability to dock the phone into the body was a really awesome experience, which is why we did it even with the risk of making people concerned with the form factor dependency. However, the gTar has a USB port so you can hook it up to any device that supports USB hosting. This is possible with most iOS devices with the aid of a camera adapter kit. We might eventually be able to produce such a special cable allowing you to hook it up directly to an iOS device.

The gTar tech was not originally intended to be for iPhone, that was a bit of an unintentional pivot we made when we met with a particular iOS app company we had a lot of respect for and wanted to impress them. Long story short, they weren't impressed but our next investor meeting went much better than those before it.

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