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CFPB Takes Action Against Coding Boot Camp BloomTech and CEO Austen Allred

consumerfinance.gov

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Re: CFPB Takes Action Against Coding Boot Camp BloomTech and CEO Austen Allred

#131

Earlier quoted context omitted.

This is one of those situations lending support to the corporate death penalty. Allowing name changes like Worldcom, Spectrum, and so on to write off some liabilities while operating as if nothing happened.

> the corporate death penalty This is a silly idea lobbyists love because it sidesteps the actual corporate-destruction mechanism: liquidation to pay massive fines, license revocation and/or personal liability for senior management. Consider even the penalties here, which effectively ban Allred and Lambda from doing business. If you corporate death’d them, the contracts and assets would still exist. Allred would be u…

> If you corporate death’d them, the contracts and assets would still exist. Allred would be unpunished. Everything would go back to shareholders who were presumably fine with the status quo, and would be fine putting them into a new entity that Allred could manage.

This is wrong for a variety of reasons:

(1) The corporate death penalty is proposed as an additional remedy, not an alternative remedy, to personal liability for officers, etc. (in fact, many corporate death penalty proposals would make additional personal penalties for corporate officers available as a part of that on top of any that would be available independently of the corporate death penalty for their actions, e.g., in one proposal for a federal charter revocation law, “The statute should specify that, for a period of five to ten years, the directors of the condemned corporation could serve on the same corporate board together only when they are a minority, ensuring that that set of directors would not form a majority of the board of another corporation. Similarly, key senior officers should be prohibited from working together for five to ten years. In addition, no director or officer could serve on the board or work for any corporation affiliated with the parent corporation of the convicted corporation. Courts must be empowered to issue injunctions to enforce these rules, preventing reconstitution of substantially the same corporation under another name.” [0])

(2) Corporate death penalty proposals tend to include proposals for how dissolved corporations are to be wound down that address the concerns you address (like a bankruptcy, these would be generally be administered by courts, probably most normally the court issuing the penalty.) From the same proposal, “The dissolution of the corporation should impose the harshest penalty on the corporate entity itself, directors, and officers, while only damaging shareholders-who have less control over corporate misconduct-to the extent necessary to incentivize them to take an interest in the corporation’s criminal misconduct. […] the penalty should dissolve the corporation with as little impact on innocent parties–employees, consumers, suppliers, and the larger economy-as possible.” [1] The proposal goes on to propose that an corporation subject to the corporate death penalty should have a court appointed “czar” take over management of its assets (similar, in a way, to a bankruptcy trustee), operating them and preparing and organizing them for sale (by default, by auction, but by other means where appropriate), with a specified distribution of the proceeds: “The statute should specify that revenues from the sale of the corporation’s assets first pay court costs and the costs of the czar’s operation during dissolution. Next, nonmanagement employees of the corporation that have clearly suffered harm due to the dissolution, such as being rendered unemployed, should be compensated through a one-time stipend. Finally, the balance should be distributed among the shareholders. In this way, the affairs of the corporation could be wrapped up in an orderly and just way that would protect innocent parties while only causing minimal harm to shareholders.” [2]

(3) As with personal sanctions, the corporate death penalty is proposed in addition to, not in replacement for, criminal fines and restitution, and civil damages that may be available. The key difference between corporate death penalty and bankruptcy is that the corporate death penalty can punish directors and officers, and it de-institutionalizes the firm in much the same way as bankruptcy, but it does so even if the amount of the monetary penalties would not render the corporation insolvent.

[0] https://www.gwlr.org/wp-content/uploads/2018/04/80-Geo.-Wash..., pp. 621-622

[1] id., pp. 628-629

[2] id., p. 630

Re: CFPB Takes Action Against Coding Boot Camp BloomTech and CEO Austen Allred

#132
post #66

I attended Lambda when it was first starting out. I think I was in the third or fourth cohort. At the time, the sell was that you didn't have to pay anything unless you got a job using the skills you learned from them. I was pretty naïve, I guess. Things seemed fine in the beginning. The instructors were good, and I liked that there were actual live classes. Things degraded very quickly. They kept changing the format…

I am high level member of a volunteer based org that does online workshops in the tech space, and does dozens of workshops in dozens of countries every year. I fail to understand how you can mess up basic things like having a predecided curriculum, good teachers, a fixed schedule, or providing quality outside class support. We do all of this on a shoestring budget. The stories I have heard about Lambda/BloomTech seem…

This is kind of true about all of Tech.

Much of the crowd here isn’t very smart.

They simply happened to be at the right place at the right time, ie a time where “software was eating the world” and also the iPhone/Android took over.

Finally, the success of the actual smart people in Tech (Google, Apple, Amazon, FB) who are largely pre-iPhone companies, meant that there was a lot of venture money flowing around, when the VCs discovered the Uber model. Spend a ton of money to establish monopolies (and break a bunch of laws along the way, which you could get away with because Tech still had a good reputation thanks again to the pre-iPhone pre Web 2.0 companies) and walk away with the money while exploiting customers, clients, governments and employees.

Re: CFPB Takes Action Against Coding Boot Camp BloomTech and CEO Austen Allred

#133

These fines seem incredibly low to me - they're slaps on the wrist!

Putting these together: "permanently bans BloomTech from all consumer-lending activities and bans Allred from any student-lending activities for ten years" "ordering BloomTech and Allred to cease collecting payments on income share loans for graduates who did not have a qualifying job, eliminate finance changes for certain agreements, and allow students the option to withdraw without penalty" This order seems like a…

> This order seems like a death sentence.

Corporations aren’t people. Ordering a scammer to knock it off isn’t even close to being a serious penalty. Allred should be in prison.

Re: CFPB Takes Action Against Coding Boot Camp BloomTech and CEO Austen Allred

#134

https://twitter.com/Austen/status/1573859253797810176 Honestly, there’s nothing really that screams dishonesty than this tweet. Saying that your outcomes are stronger than ever when every tech company was laying off and headcount was frozen just doesn’t pass the smell test.

> Honestly, there’s nothing really that screams dishonesty [more] than this tweet.

I was puzzled for bit, but I think you may have accidentally a word.

Re: CFPB Takes Action Against Coding Boot Camp BloomTech and CEO Austen Allred

#135
post #66

I attended Lambda when it was first starting out. I think I was in the third or fourth cohort. At the time, the sell was that you didn't have to pay anything unless you got a job using the skills you learned from them. I was pretty naïve, I guess. Things seemed fine in the beginning. The instructors were good, and I liked that there were actual live classes. Things degraded very quickly. They kept changing the format…

I am high level member of a volunteer based org that does online workshops in the tech space, and does dozens of workshops in dozens of countries every year. I fail to understand how you can mess up basic things like having a predecided curriculum, good teachers, a fixed schedule, or providing quality outside class support. We do all of this on a shoestring budget. The stories I have heard about Lambda/BloomTech seem…

Not surprising. Was the founder technical? Have any insight about education?

Re: CFPB Takes Action Against Coding Boot Camp BloomTech and CEO Austen Allred

#136

Am I crazy, or do fines never come close to matching damages? Or jailtime? I'm constantly seeing rulings or indictments where an article says "defendant faces $1500 in fines or two years jail time", as if those are in any way equivalent. Were all the fine quantities written up in 1875 and just never got updated? In this case, defendants are accused of conning "at least 11,000 income share loans" "carrying an average…

> Am I crazy, or do fines never come close to matching damages?

Fines aren’t intended to replace damages. If they are criminal fines, criminal restitution is also available through the same process. Even where criminal restitution isn’t available or, for whatever reason, pursued, or where the fines are civil, civil damages for those harmed are not precluded by the fines, they are on top of the fines. Fines are punishment, not compensation.

Re: CFPB Takes Action Against Coding Boot Camp BloomTech and CEO Austen Allred

#137

There's probably a good argument to ignore rule breaking and little deceptive marketing if the student outcomes are good but it looks like in-aggregate that they weren't and that students were better off taking a loan and attending Oregon State's Post Bac in CS or Hack Reactor.

> There’s probably a good argument to ignore rule breaking and little deceptive marketing if the student outcomes are good

A big thing that rule breaking and deceptive marketing due is cover up that the student outcomes are not good.

Re: CFPB Takes Action Against Coding Boot Camp BloomTech and CEO Austen Allred

#138
Paul Graham, 2020: "Lambda School will teach you programming faster than most colleges. And it not only works well remotely, but was designed to from the start." [1]

Paul Graham, 2022: "Of 1277 students who graduated from Lambda School in 2020 and sought jobs, 950 got them, for a placement rate of 74.8%.

(Lambda's weirdly dedicated haters will be happy to hear that these numbers were audited by an accounting firm.)" [2]

[1] https://twitter.com/paulg/status/1254809755681525762

[2] https://twitter.com/paulg/status/1254809755681525762

Re: CFPB Takes Action Against Coding Boot Camp BloomTech and CEO Austen Allred

#139

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Putting these together: "permanently bans BloomTech from all consumer-lending activities and bans Allred from any student-lending activities for ten years" "ordering BloomTech and Allred to cease collecting payments on income share loans for graduates who did not have a qualifying job, eliminate finance changes for certain agreements, and allow students the option to withdraw without penalty" This order seems like a…

> This order seems like a death sentence. Corporations aren’t people. Ordering a scammer to knock it off isn’t even close to being a serious penalty. Allred should be in prison.

> Allred should be in prison.

The CFPB, like every federal regulatory agency, has only direct civil enforcement powers.

They refer criminal matters to the Department of Justice, which usually takes significantly longer before handing down charges, and does not usually disclose the existence of an open investigation until and unless it issues an indictment.

Re: CFPB Takes Action Against Coding Boot Camp BloomTech and CEO Austen Allred

#140
post #93

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Because of diffusion of responsibility, wherein the person taking the fall was only one of perhaps three dozen individuals who collaborated to make the relevant business decisions. If you to set the precedent of consolidating the consequences and doling them out to the relevant executive officer you’ll end up with c-suite executives around the country throwing their personal and corporate influence into getting that…

How doed charging executives in addition to fining a company an amount that puts the card company into unresolvable bankruptcy lead to "diffusion of responsibility"? Yeah, rich CEOs and investors are opposed to taking any responsibility for their actions, but that doesn't we shouldn't try to hold them responsible.

It doesn’t lead to a diffusion of responsibility, the diffusion exists independently by nature of how a business operates.

A CEO will green light high level strategic direction, but the crimes described here could easily emerge from the implementation of that directive at lower levels of the company. “Plausible deniability”

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