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We need to rewild the internet

noemamag.com

201–210 of 273 posts

Re: We need to rewild the internet

#201
post #2

More people should be tending their "digital gardens" just to have something to curate and share. Bring back the weird, the odd, the deep-dives into topics you never imagined having such detail, bring back the strange animated GIFS, the websites always "under construction", give me your weird, give me your odd, this should be everyone's place to be free.

That stuff is still around, it's just on Discord and VRChat now.

People that want to stay more anonymous are exemt from Discord. I get the draw of the platform, but the negatives are undeniable.

Re: We need to rewild the internet

#202
post #20

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> It reads like something a GPT model would write, they go all over the place. It's nothing like GPT IMO; it's opinionated, for one thing. I think it's just hard to follow because it does draw from a large variety of sources and ideas and doesn't weave them together very smoothly. This is showcased with the horrible modern trend of displaying a large quote of something the article literally just said, or will say nex…

Wilder doesn't necessarily equal more anonymous. I spend a lot of time on little forums where I might not know someone's irl name but I know who they are.

One of the great losses that came with the end of the forum era was all these little communities with distinct cultures and regulars that you got to know.

I kind of found a similar vibe in some discord servers, but they're much more difficult to join as a new user than a forum because old information isn't easily searchable and discussions aren't as longform as old forum posts were.

Re: We need to rewild the internet

#203
post #179

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> We cannot tell all people below certain IQ to just stop using the internet What, why not? It couldn't be that hard to trick them.

Start an ssh-only bbs.

I have considered something like that in the past. The problem is that you can't stop someone else from making a web frontend (with ads on it, of course) and now you're back to were you started.

Re: We need to rewild the internet

#204
post #137

Earlier quoted context omitted.

This is literally the point of the article. That's all posted inside the twitter walled garden. Great content, wrong platform.

RSS handles syndication, but how would their deep-dives be discoverable if they had been posted to personal blog sites? That's a missing piece of the puzzle for the distributed web; curation and recommendation are ad-hoc and don't scale.

They'd be discoverable by search or linking. The distributed web is compatible with feeds. It's what's happening on this site too. Except the content would be packaged and redistributable and wouldn't disappear when the original service goes down or such.

Re: We need to rewild the internet

#205
> ... So-called “scientific forestry,” was that century’s growth hacking: it made timber yields easier to count, predict and harvest, and meant owners no longer relied on skilled local foresters to manage forests. ...

This is a general principle of optimization, which maximises efficiency at the expense of redundancy and anti-fragility. Unfortunately, the ability to withstand an unexpected catastrophe does not appear on a balance sheet until the catastrophe strikes.

Re: We need to rewild the internet

#206

> ... So-called “scientific forestry,” was that century’s growth hacking: it made timber yields easier to count, predict and harvest, and meant owners no longer relied on skilled local foresters to manage forests. ... This is a general principle of optimization, which maximises efficiency at the expense of redundancy and anti-fragility. Unfortunately, the ability to withstand an unexpected catastrophe does not appear…

And then (as a general rule in the modern economy), if catastrophe strikes and you get a bailout, you have successfully socialized the risk. Profit!

Re: We need to rewild the internet

#207

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Self-hosting means taking a second job as a sysadmin, applying software updates all the time, patching emergency security vulnerabilities, hardening services against constant attacks, deciding whether the daily "I have found a bug in your system and will disclose" mails are legitimate threats. If you fail at any of these tasks, relatively new regulations mean various governments can fine you more than your net worth…

Vaguely sensible initial setup (doable from a template or script) and automatic updates (enable these from a script) solves like 99% of this problem.

someone should make a GUI and a subscription service for that. Oh wait, you just invented the current state of the web :/

Re: We need to rewild the internet

#208

It's a nice essay but like so many in this space, it's really missing a key force that encourages consolidation, fights diversification, and pushes companies to centralize as much as they can into as few services as possible: Users. Users demonstrate, by their behavior, again and again, that they want simple, they want turnkey, they want inter-operation, and they want stability. And the big corps generally succeed in…

This didn’t have to be the case. It was purpose built around these megalithic designs by these large companies. Now advertising and culture curation ensure it’s always displayed in a positive light. Google, Apple, MS, all know to use angelic white light in their branding (slight hazy, blurry, seems to penetrate where it shouldn’t be). Apple stores even mimic a church design. It’s not that people don’t want to. They don’t know any better and are addicted.

These are not scions of capitalism. These are anti-competitive ecosystems by design. Having to do more work wouldn’t be a thing if the protocols were designed to aid communication outside of corporate channels. People are afraid, not unwilling. Big brother says it’s not safe, so they go to the cozy sphere they know and regrettably trust with too much of their lives.

It’s a nation state problem too. The US gets economic advantage from having the major players local. It’s hard not to lose ground when a federated system in Sweden or China can chip away at your control base. So we subsidize and solidify. We get temporary advantage for long-term decay and virtual feudalism.

People lived under monarchies for a long time before a streak of luck, war, and land changed it.

Re: We need to rewild the internet

#209

It is surprisingly easy to set up a phpBB forum or some such thing, on a tiny VM tucked into some obscure pool, set up a nameserver for it, invite a couple of your friends, and start your own community, completely disengaged from any major corporate shenanigans. Big things can happen with such a virtual machine. Even better, you could a mailman server, and get yourself a proper mailing-list of like-minded subscribers…

Sounds very cool, I am interested in hearing more. I'm not sure how well I follow how one could set this up, basically. What constitutes a "tiny VM tucked into some obscure pool", what are you thinking of here? And are you saying this could work with a few technically-minded friends, or with anyone? It's hard to imagine it working with anyone. Not to be a negative Nancy or anything, I wish it were possible all the sa…

>"tiny VM tucked into some obscure pool", what are you thinking of here?

I imagine the OP meant that you can do a lot of things with just a tiny little VM, included in a pool of larger VM's somewhere, unassuming .. just off to the side of the main budget.

>And are you saying this could work with a few technically-minded friends, or with anyone?

Once you get a phpBB/mailmain system set up, its really easy to send less technically-inclined folks towards the community - but indeed, community-run servers tend to survive longer than those led by a BDFL ..

Re: We need to rewild the internet

#210
post #83

It is surprisingly easy to set up a phpBB forum or some such thing, on a tiny VM tucked into some obscure pool, set up a nameserver for it, invite a couple of your friends, and start your own community, completely disengaged from any major corporate shenanigans. Big things can happen with such a virtual machine. Even better, you could a mailman server, and get yourself a proper mailing-list of like-minded subscribers…

The barrier to entry for running your own site (something dynamic, as opposed to static hosting) is essentially the same in 2024 as it was in 2004. Gotta get a domain (and keep it registered). Gotta have an SSL cert (letsencrypt makes it better). Raspberry pi can run a lot, but getting your consumer ISP to give you a static IP is still more money. Definitely more VPS options now though. But self hosting your still ba…

You only need a couple technically competent members to keep things going .. its not that hard .. and in any community there is always a certain percentage of folks who want to learn these things, anyway ..

The point is it can be done, easily enough. We don't need these walled gardens.

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