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I’m tired of the opportunists and their hackathons

ryanleecarson.tumblr.com

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Re: I’m tired of the opportunists and their hackathons

#81

Post by EternalFury »

I think the point was: Do whatever makes you happy any way you want it, but don't project any particular model as the best or only way to reach the ultimate goal.

I can write great code alone, in my man cave, with a glass of wine or a bottle of beer. It works for me. Coding in more public places also works for me. Coding in the backyard is great as well. Doing pair programming with a friend is also awesome.

But, I would never impose these various ways to code as being better or worse than any other.

Because Facebook got so rich so fast, there is definitely a crowd of people out there, who believe in silver bullets and who now claim that a hacker that won't join hackathons can't be good. That's nonsense.

Re: I’m tired of the opportunists and their hackathons

#82

Post by sbisker »

philwelch wrote: post #79
sbisker wrote: post #36

Earlier quoted context omitted.

On that note, I really wish commenting was turned back on for HN job postings. I understand why they were turned off - people trying to expose anonymity for instance - but since they left, I feel like I see worse and worse postings, with little repercussions - or at least community feedback - to the companies who post...

Comments were never "on" for HN job postings.

Ok, strictly speaking, YC companies would just post the jobs as regular submissions, and the job posting category came in part to shut off commenting. The point remains the same though.

Re: I’m tired of the opportunists and their hackathons

#83

Post by paulhauggis »

drumdance wrote: post #56
paulhauggis wrote: post #33

Earlier quoted context omitted.

"They’re probably just trying to cash in on your youth and optimism." I find this about most companies, especially in silicon valley. Just look at Google or Facebook. They get 20 somethings right out of college and work them to the bone on a salary (IE: you don't get paid any extra). Sure, you can go home at 5, but you most likely won't get a promotion when everyone around you is working until 7 or 8.

IME your description of twenty-somethings as cannon fodder is more common on Wall Street and at IT consulting firms than Silicon Valley. For example, everything I've read is that Facebook does not overwork their employees in the course of normal business. http://www.quora.com/Facebook-Inc-company/What-are-the-avera... In the very early days of a startup (< 50 employees), people often work crazy hours. But everything…

"more common on Wall Street"

It's common with both.

"For example, everything I've read is that Facebook does not overwork their employees in the course of normal business."

This isn't what I've heard at all..from people working there now. These companies don't say you are required to work past 40 hours. However, it's part of the culture.

This is most likely because they hire right out of college and the employees have no obligations, which allow them to make work their life.

Re: I’m tired of the opportunists and their hackathons

#84

Post by eli_gottlieb »

mekarpeles wrote: post #62

Sometimes it's not about opportunism. I live in a 4 bedroom hacker house with 11 entrepreneurs/programmers. It's cramped, we have bunk beds and sleeping bags. I've personally never been happier. Despite many of us being (second time) founders of companies, contractors, or having jobs, we hack together several times a week, work 14+ hour days (including weekends), manage CodeSF events monthly, find time to attend hack…

There are also a lot of people who are genuinely enthused (obsessed) with computer science and who devote their lives to knowledge... Who learn how to implement JK flip flops on a breadboard, build languages entirely from lambda calculus, and study convex optimization in their free time. More importantly, they do so because they love hacking, not because they love being a hacker (though I admit hacker culture and community is something I value).

Somehow I don't think graduate students are in on this Valley subculture stuff.

Re: I’m tired of the opportunists and their hackathons

#85

Post by ryancarson »

venturebros wrote: post #71

Isn't pushing perks like 4-day work week,etc you do at your company the same thing you are talking about regarding trying to cash in on someones youth and optimism?

Theoretically, the people that benefit the most from 4-day weeks are Dads and Mom as they can spend 50% more time with their kids.

Re: I’m tired of the opportunists and their hackathons

#88

Post by mekarpeles »

eli_gottlieb wrote: post #84
mekarpeles wrote: post #62

Sometimes it's not about opportunism. I live in a 4 bedroom hacker house with 11 entrepreneurs/programmers. It's cramped, we have bunk beds and sleeping bags. I've personally never been happier. Despite many of us being (second time) founders of companies, contractors, or having jobs, we hack together several times a week, work 14+ hour days (including weekends), manage CodeSF events monthly, find time to attend hack…

There are also a lot of people who are genuinely enthused (obsessed) with computer science and who devote their lives to knowledge... Who learn how to implement JK flip flops on a breadboard, build languages entirely from lambda calculus, and study convex optimization in their free time. More importantly, they do so because they love hacking, not because they love being a hacker (though I admit hacker culture and com…

I appreciate your perspective. I can only speak from personal experience. I am a PhD dropout passionate about entrepreneurship and computer science (I must admit I gravitate more to hacker culture than valley subculture).

I think graduate school is actually a pretty good selector since many people attend graduate school because they are passionate about academia. I think Stanford is a good example of a source where graduate students have gone on to lead successful ventures in the valley.

Re: I’m tired of the opportunists and their hackathons

#89

Post by EnderMB »

A friend of mine used to work as a lawyer, and many of them used to get involved in mock trials, where they could test themselves on a complicated case and see how the other half does things.

Although this isn't much different and an argument against this post I do agree with Ryan Carson in that a lot of developers are judged on things they do outside of work, as if not going to hackathons or working on open-source projects makes you a worse coder than someone who does.

I work on my own projects from time to time, but I know many developers who treat it as a 9-6 job and a good number of them are far better than me. Carson is right in that there are a LOT of opportunists out there who are more than happy to take advantage of developers. I know people in my own area that use hackathons as a way to promote their own company, and while they're not "selling" this code they're definitely using it as a way to promote their business.

Should developers care? Probably not, but given the attitude towards developers in general more of them would do good to be more cynical.

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