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Jack Ma steps out from the shadows with morale-boosting post

reuters.com

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Re: Jack Ma steps out from the shadows with morale-boosting post

#41

Post by janalsncm »

WrongAssumption wrote: post #34
maxglute wrote: post #24

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> it is safe to build wealth in the US It's safe to build OBSCENE wealth in the states. It's safe to build wealth in PRC, plenty of 10-100 millionaires. It's also safe to build OBSCENE wealth in PRC, but it comes with more political caveats. Like not trying circumvent regulators by launching irresponsible fintech. Which system is better depends on how much you value checking billionaires.

There are over 100 billionaires in the Chinese parliament, the US congress has zero billionaires.

Just like it’s better to have a friend who has a boat than to own a boat, it’s better to buy a politician than to be one.

Re: Jack Ma steps out from the shadows with morale-boosting post

#42

Post by Arnt »

flooow wrote: post #20

[flagged]

There's one in the city where I live. Her fortune is a company (you have all heard its name) so in a certain sense her wealth is putting a number on a large number of voters' jobs.

Recently the company decided it needed a plot of land, located in the middle between there of its sites. It got that plot.

Call it an oligarch or call it well-paid voters' jobs. I think the later is truer.

Re: Jack Ma steps out from the shadows with morale-boosting post

#43

Post by serial_dev »

re wrote: post #16
starspangled wrote: post #14

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The young in China knows what? What do you mean by laying flat, and do you have any data for emigration trends?

>laying flat https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Tang_ping

Only because there is a term for it in Chinese, it doesn't mean this problem unique to China in any way. And it also didn't start in 2022 when "quiet quitting" became popular, it's a tale as old as time.

Re: Jack Ma steps out from the shadows with morale-boosting post

#44

Post by dageshi »

maxglute wrote: post #29
55555 wrote: post #22

Earlier quoted context omitted.

This is a phenomenon we see in the entire developed world, or possibly the entire world, including in the west and Japan (NEETs, Hikikomori).

Tanping is just slacking. Tanping kids still work. But it's still the same phenonmenon as the developed world, PRC single kids who grew up with silver spoon and high expectations realizing that they're pretty mid, and can't out compete their "betters". So they slack and take life easier. It's basically the normal distribution in every western workplace. Workers with prospects still grind to work their way up the (inv…

I think it's a bit more serious than that. Those self same "mid" kids would've had no problems meeting expectations if they'd been born 10 or 20 years ago because China was experiencing one of the most unprecedented growth periods in history.

If growth stalls but expectations of what "success" looks like in life remain the same then inevitably the more rational amongst them will look and see that just achieving a "normal" life seems incredibly difficult.

Re: Jack Ma steps out from the shadows with morale-boosting post

#45

Post by maxglute »

WrongAssumption wrote: post #34
maxglute wrote: post #24

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> it is safe to build wealth in the US It's safe to build OBSCENE wealth in the states. It's safe to build wealth in PRC, plenty of 10-100 millionaires. It's also safe to build OBSCENE wealth in PRC, but it comes with more political caveats. Like not trying circumvent regulators by launching irresponsible fintech. Which system is better depends on how much you value checking billionaires.

There are over 100 billionaires in the Chinese parliament, the US congress has zero billionaires.

They're rubber stamp deputies who are selected/invited to NPC because they're important entrepreneurs, which correlates to being billionaires. But they don't influence shit, they know their place, enough to waste a week or two a year at two sessions. Which is precisely the original point - it's safe to build obscene wealth in PRC... close to 1,000 billionaires know how to not be politically retarded vs the minority that don't. Last available IIRC stat was ~15% of billionaires in PRC end up in jail (corruption/CCDI). I don't know that number for US is, but probably too low.

Re: Jack Ma steps out from the shadows with morale-boosting post

#46

Post by maxglute »

gscott wrote: post #33
maxglute wrote: post #24

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> it is safe to build wealth in the US It's safe to build OBSCENE wealth in the states. It's safe to build wealth in PRC, plenty of 10-100 millionaires. It's also safe to build OBSCENE wealth in PRC, but it comes with more political caveats. Like not trying circumvent regulators by launching irresponsible fintech. Which system is better depends on how much you value checking billionaires.

Building wealth in China you have to keep it there due to tight capital controls. In the USA you can transfer it out of the country if you want to. https://www.scmp.com/business/china-business/article/3212414... https://www.smh.com.au/business/the-economy/china-s-rich-are... https://www.rfa.org/english/news/china/china-banks-waits-072... https://harris-sliwoski.com/chinalawblog/getting-money-out-o... https://www.afr.…

And? They can financial engineer a few 100 million out of country and have generational wealth stashed abroad or be a boring billinoaire in PRC. Flashing extravagant lavishness is frowned upon, maybe settle for a 300 ft yacht instead of a 600ft mega yacht like a RU oligarch or Arab crown prince. They're billionaires they can get pretty much what they want, not upper-middle class family from tier1 city trying to figure out how to wire >50kUSD to pay their kids rent and tuition.

Re: Jack Ma steps out from the shadows with morale-boosting post

#48

Post by maxglute »

dageshi wrote: post #44
maxglute wrote: post #29

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Tanping is just slacking. Tanping kids still work. But it's still the same phenonmenon as the developed world, PRC single kids who grew up with silver spoon and high expectations realizing that they're pretty mid, and can't out compete their "betters". So they slack and take life easier. It's basically the normal distribution in every western workplace. Workers with prospects still grind to work their way up the (inv…

I think it's a bit more serious than that. Those self same "mid" kids would've had no problems meeting expectations if they'd been born 10 or 20 years ago because China was experiencing one of the most unprecedented growth periods in history. If growth stalls but expectations of what "success" looks like in life remain the same then inevitably the more rational amongst them will look and see that just achieving a "no…

Those same mid kids would likely work a medicore blue collar job but be able to afford real estate after a few years of saving while the market was low. Some of them might be lucky and have first mover entreprenured their way to being million/billionaires despite not being very bright (like Ma). Same lament as kids in west when their parents worked mid jobs and could raise a family. Dual income young professional households who can't buy a house while their parents without degrees have multipe + land in cottage country. Now PRC kids dealing with same shit kids in west are, academic inflation + increase cost of living + easy speculative R/E wealth is gone. Meanwhile no one wants to do "hard" work because they spend too much time in school to do manual labour. They want top 10% income air conditioned office jobs befitting their degree.

I'm not saying it's not serious, it's also not particularly special to PRC. Like the few tanping kids I hear about IRL in PRC are like your typical western kids with comfortably wealthy boomer parents who can afford to fuck around because they got safety net/inheritance down the line. Everyone else grinding while joking about tanping, like antiwork folks in the west bitch about their conditions, but eat continue to eat shit all the same.

Re: Jack Ma steps out from the shadows with morale-boosting post

#49

Post by gmerc »

roenxi wrote: post #2

Just going by appearances, the story at the time looked a lot like Jack Ma fleeing the country for a bit. One minute he was disturbing the tranquillity in China then the next he was picking up some Zen among the cherry blossoms. It is interesting to compare-and-contrast Jack Ma and Elon Musk who seems to me the nearest analogue in the US. How their host countries treat them says a lot about the real cultural differen…

It’s safe to build wealth and become untouchable and unaccountable in the US, all the way to attempting a coup

Re: Jack Ma steps out from the shadows with morale-boosting post

#50

Post by tsimionescu »

cm2187 wrote: post #28
Dalewyn wrote: post #23

Earlier quoted context omitted.

No, NEET stands for "Not Employed, Educating, or Training" and Hikikomori translates literally to "Pulling Back In". Both phenomena result in the individual abdicating his productivity in deference to pursuits such as resolving crises and introspection. Tang Ping on the other hand is a phenomenon where the individual only produces as much as his environment demands of him. If he contracted with his employer to work 9…

In other words the Homo Sovieticus.

The Soviet work ethic was "they pretend to pay us, we pretend to work". It wasn't about doing the bare minimum for your job, it was about finding creative ways to do much less than the bare minimum.
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