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How to found a company in Germany: 14 "easy" steps and lots of pain

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Re: How to found a company in Germany: 14 "easy" steps and lots of pain

#291

Post by api »

dotnet00 wrote: post #273
callalex wrote: post #235

Earlier quoted context omitted.

From a USA perspective, I find that usually when a bureaucratic process is hopelessly broken, it is because a small portion of the population actively hates the people that would benefit from the process and want to harm them. However they cannot legally or popularly discriminate against them so instead they destroy the processes that benefit the hated group. Do you get that impression where you are too?

As the other user said, this is just the conspiracy politcs obsessed partisan weirdos would like for you to believe. After all, if their side is so benevolent and immigrant loving, why haven't they pushed any genuine immigration system reforms instead of just creating a captive subclass in the form of illegal immigrants? For instance, if Republicans are really so hateful of certain minorities, why do they not properl…

I don’t like to both sides many things but immigration is definitely one case. The system is broken on purpose because US agriculture, construction, and many other labor intensive trades can’t operate profitably without a migrant labor underclass. Nobody wants to fix this. Not Democrats, not Republicans.

Add to that the fact that the Republicans now have a second reason not to fix immigration: they can’t run on it if it’s not broken.

If Trump gets in again he will do a lot of anti immigration theater for his base but nothing will really change. Democrats won’t fix it either. Someone has to pick berries and trim hedges.

Re: How to found a company in Germany: 14 "easy" steps and lots of pain

#292

Post by web3-is-a-scam »

dark-star wrote: post #210
miohtama wrote: post #187

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Get married in Denmark: This not a joke, but my friends did it (German woman, Indian husband). It Germany it would have taken two weeks. In Denmark you get it done in an hour (minus the booking of the time at the civil registry).

I fail to imagine a scenario where "getting married fast" is a requirement. I mean you've supposedly been living together for a few years already at that point, so why is 2 weeks too much?

I had to get married fast because my travel agent failed to get our wedding license to Jamaica fast enough for our destination wedding to be legal in Canada. So we got married a few days before leaving to Jamaica and had the pastor on the resort “officiate” for the family experience even if we were already married (nobody knew except us). The “two weddings” were only a few days apart. My pastor at home dropped everything to marry us the afternoon we called him with our dilemma.

Re: How to found a company in Germany: 14 "easy" steps and lots of pain

#293

Post by Havoc »

hariharan_uno wrote: post #160
nicbou wrote: post #114

I document German bureaucracy for a living,[0] and everything is like that. Every life event - immigrating, getting a job, getting married, having a child, buying a car - is mired in slow, paper-based bureaucracy. It is a constant, significant impediment to life in the country. Just last week, I was telling people that the best way to get married in Germany is to get married in Denmark. I cannot overstate how terribl…

I completely agree. I have been living here for 8 years, and recently applied for a permanent settlement permit. My application went into a blackhole for more than 4 months, while my existing permit expired, essentially making me a prisoner here (I can stay and work in Germany but if I travel internationally, I won't be allowed entry back). Meanwhile, my applications for a temporary travel permit were unanswered for…

It’s not just Germany - I’ve got a similar can’t leave situation in UK currently

Re: How to found a company in Germany: 14 "easy" steps and lots of pain

#294

Post by PurpleRamen »

addandsubtract wrote: post #272
PurpleRamen wrote: post #176

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Debitcards, not girocards. I have no girocard since years, and still can easily pay everywhere. But to be fair, the pandemia really pushed this even the small shops.

Ämter only take girocards or cash.

Not true. It probably depends on the location, but last time I paid for a public service, I had no problem using my Visa Debit Card. I think it was not even possible to use cash.

Re: How to found a company in Germany: 14 "easy" steps and lots of pain

#295

Post by ab_testing »

hariharan_uno wrote: post #160
nicbou wrote: post #114

I document German bureaucracy for a living,[0] and everything is like that. Every life event - immigrating, getting a job, getting married, having a child, buying a car - is mired in slow, paper-based bureaucracy. It is a constant, significant impediment to life in the country. Just last week, I was telling people that the best way to get married in Germany is to get married in Denmark. I cannot overstate how terribl…

I completely agree. I have been living here for 8 years, and recently applied for a permanent settlement permit. My application went into a blackhole for more than 4 months, while my existing permit expired, essentially making me a prisoner here (I can stay and work in Germany but if I travel internationally, I won't be allowed entry back). Meanwhile, my applications for a temporary travel permit were unanswered for…

Not saying Germany is slow, but that is one area where US is far behind. 21 Months - This is the current processing time for a green card after you have sent in all the paperwork to the USCIS for processing. During that time, you get no updates and of-course if you leave the country without AP, your application is considered to be abandoned.

https://imgur.com/a/t8rYOjv

Re: How to found a company in Germany: 14 "easy" steps and lots of pain

#296

Post by makeitdouble »

hariharan_uno wrote: post #160
nicbou wrote: post #114

I document German bureaucracy for a living,[0] and everything is like that. Every life event - immigrating, getting a job, getting married, having a child, buying a car - is mired in slow, paper-based bureaucracy. It is a constant, significant impediment to life in the country. Just last week, I was telling people that the best way to get married in Germany is to get married in Denmark. I cannot overstate how terribl…

I completely agree. I have been living here for 8 years, and recently applied for a permanent settlement permit. My application went into a blackhole for more than 4 months, while my existing permit expired, essentially making me a prisoner here (I can stay and work in Germany but if I travel internationally, I won't be allowed entry back). Meanwhile, my applications for a temporary travel permit were unanswered for…

As far as I know, it's par for the course for immigration in most countries I ever heard of. On the other hand, anyone who heard of consistently nice immigration procedure for normal people (not Messi) should chime in.

From a incentive strucutre POV, they lose nothing from false positives (denying entry to someone who would have been fine) as candidates will probably try again anyway, and no one will come after them for their shitty procedures as by definition applicants aren't full voting citizens and stay in a weaker position possibly all their life (imagine filing a complaint and having your name on a black list the rest of your immigration life, even if that list probably doesn't exist. That fear alone is enough to let a lot of things slide)

Re: How to found a company in Germany: 14 "easy" steps and lots of pain

#297

Post by Freedom2 »

smabie wrote: post #276
4ad wrote: post #189

Earlier quoted context omitted.

As bad as Germany is, it is better than average. Eastern Europe is harder, and Asia borders on impossible. Africa is literally impossible.

Africa and Asia are pretty easy, you just pay a bribe

Could you elaborate on this? I had a friend who joked about paying a bribe in Japan or Taiwan, do you think it would work there?

Re: How to found a company in Germany: 14 "easy" steps and lots of pain

#298

Post by Propelloni »

robert_foss wrote: post #60

Having founded a company in Germany, I would never under any circumstances do it again. Notaries should not exist, and could be replaced by a simple website. It's all incredibly tedious and slow, and there are lots of reoccurring work and fees. Closing a company takes 2-3 years too, even if there are no irregularities.

I'm not doubting your experience but mine is different. I'm doing business in the Köln/Düsseldorf area and while the experience could be nicer, it is far from terrible. I have been involved in founding five companies (four GmbH and one GmbH & Co. KG) and closing one down in the last 10 years and I would have no qualms to go for another one. Each founding took about 6-8 weeks from first filing to entry into the registry. Getting a VAT ID can take a few weeks longer -- or in one case months longer -- but you can do business with your normal company tax ID and sort it out at the end of the year. If you are really in a hurry, buy a shell company for a few grands plus corpus and you can be running within a week or two. Notaries are really helpful in that case.

From my point of view there are also not many fees and none of them are recurring. IIRC, you have to pay the notary, the registry and the tax office for services rendered. Once you are registered, there are other fees, e.g. IHK (trade association) membership or insurances, but that is not part of the registration, that is cost of doing business.

Liquidation on the other hand takes 12 month (a transitory period required by law) and a few weeks before and after the liquidation for notary appointments. That's it. All in all it took maybe 18 month from decision point to deletion from the registry and the main part of the extra 6 month was deliberation what needed to be done before the transition started.

Re: How to found a company in Germany: 14 "easy" steps and lots of pain

#299

Post by barbazoo »

makeitdouble wrote: post #296
hariharan_uno wrote: post #160

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I completely agree. I have been living here for 8 years, and recently applied for a permanent settlement permit. My application went into a blackhole for more than 4 months, while my existing permit expired, essentially making me a prisoner here (I can stay and work in Germany but if I travel internationally, I won't be allowed entry back). Meanwhile, my applications for a temporary travel permit were unanswered for…

As far as I know, it's par for the course for immigration in most countries I ever heard of. On the other hand, anyone who heard of consistently nice immigration procedure for normal people (not Messi) should chime in. From a incentive strucutre POV, they lose nothing from false positives (denying entry to someone who would have been fine) as candidates will probably try again anyway, and no one will come after them…

Other countries that see immigration as an opportunity have systems that are far far superior to that of Germany. In Germany it's often not clear what status a process is in and no way to get updates. There often is no web portal or anything like that, it's nuts. For instance you submit an application for the retention of your German passport and then basically wait 2+ years for the answer to come back. No one answered my questions. It's very frustrating. On top of that I got threatened with the BKA if I didn't surrender certain documents without ever having been asked to in the first place. Straight to escalation. It's just very unpleasant. Maybe that should be their motto.

Re: How to found a company in Germany: 14 "easy" steps and lots of pain

#300

Post by barbazoo »

Keyframe wrote: post #218
fleshmonad wrote: post #184

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Note that I am a German. I would say there are few. Bad education, especially in schools, a broken railway and public transport system, as well as incredibly high taxes. You may say "free healthcare" and a point can be made here, but when you take a look at the high taxes you have to pay, it's not worth it, if your income is above average. All in all it's a mess and I haven't even begun speaking about German people a…

(rants) yep, you are German alright!

In certain parts of Germany the German equivalent of "You really can't complain" is the highest form of praise.
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