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Physically healthy 28-year-old woman schedules euthanasia due to depression

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Re: Physically healthy 28-year-old woman schedules euthanasia due to depression

#51

Post by bheadmaster »

xanderlewis wrote: post #31
bheadmaster wrote: post #25

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I believe this is yet another case of people being skeptical about the very existence of mental illness. Euthanasia for incurable cancer patients is a no-brainer, but for incurable depression sufferers? Well, their bodies are healthy. What if it's just a phase they'll grow out of? Maybe they're just faking it? They should probably be more grateful for the gifts they've received from God, and they'll be happy. Maybe t…

> Euthanasia for incurable cancer patients is a no-brainer This is absolutely not a universally held belief.

Of course not - no belief is.

My point was that it is drastically easier to believe that euthanasia for cancer patients is okay, than for depression sufferers.

Re: Physically healthy 28-year-old woman schedules euthanasia due to depression

#52

Post by phantomathkg »

xeornet wrote: post #24
iagooar wrote: post #5

I am terrified of the thought of legally killing people and this article has made me feel quite odd, even slightly sick I would say. My gut just screams at me: this is wrong. And I cannot help. The rational arguments do not convince me at all. Call me old fashioned or whatever but this is how I feel about it, and since there is an article about this I imagine that there might be certain interest in this being out of…

Totally agree. It also begs the question, are the people in these situations even mentally fit enough to make the decision rationally? With the limited context I have, I don’t think so. There’d also a lot of reliance on the doctor’s “its never going to get better” - yet time and time again with physical ailments we hear of the impossibility of recovery yet many do recover.

> It also begs the question, are the people in these situations even mentally fit enough to make the decision rationally? With the limited context I have, I don’t think so.

Without euthanasia. A person in that situation can and will choose other means to kill himself/herself.

Re: Physically healthy 28-year-old woman schedules euthanasia due to depression

#53

Post by felsokning »

iagooar wrote: post #5

I am terrified of the thought of legally killing people and this article has made me feel quite odd, even slightly sick I would say. My gut just screams at me: this is wrong. And I cannot help. The rational arguments do not convince me at all. Call me old fashioned or whatever but this is how I feel about it, and since there is an article about this I imagine that there might be certain interest in this being out of…

>...there might be certain interest in this being out of the ordinary.

I think, maybe, you weren't aware of it's legality; especially, in the Netherlands[1]?

[1] - https://www.government.nl/topics/euthanasia/euthanasia-assis...

Re: Physically healthy 28-year-old woman schedules euthanasia due to depression

#54

Post by salesynerd »

It's a very difficult choice to make and I have full sympathies for the lady. I also respect herc choice, considering that it was made by her own free will and complies with the law of the land.

However, I still feel a bit conflicted about this situation. As per the report, she is physically fit, has a loving boyfriend, a pet cat, and doesn't seem to be in any monetary duress. Plus, she happens to be living in one of the happiest and prosperous countries in the world.

When I compare her with a vast multitude of people in developing countries who continue to toil against all odds (physical, mental, societal, economic, etc.), I feel that she should have been encouraged to not give up.

An old song that has always stuck with me has lyrics that say, "there is so much pain in the world; (comparatively) my pain is so little. When I saw people's pain, I forgot my own."

Of course, these are just my thoughts. I fully respect her (& everybody else's) rights to decide what's best for them. May she be at peace with her decision and enjoy her remaining days in a better frame of mind.

Re: Physically healthy 28-year-old woman schedules euthanasia due to depression

#55

Post by dietr1ch »

tafox wrote: post #15
iagooar wrote: post #5

I am terrified of the thought of legally killing people and this article has made me feel quite odd, even slightly sick I would say. My gut just screams at me: this is wrong. And I cannot help. The rational arguments do not convince me at all. Call me old fashioned or whatever but this is how I feel about it, and since there is an article about this I imagine that there might be certain interest in this being out of…

Maybe if we weren't treated like de facto slaves for the rich life would be worth living.

Yeah, all the productivity improvements could be used to make everyone's lives better, but hey, some people really need yatchs, cars they can't really drive, multiple houses and more.

Re: Physically healthy 28-year-old woman schedules euthanasia due to depression

#56

Post by someotherperson »

sneak wrote: post #4

I wish more countries recognized the ultimate and inviolable right to self ownership. If we aren’t free to destroy ourselves if we so desire, we aren’t actually free.

It has little to do with an "inviolable right to self ownership" -- the overwhelming majority of the world already have that. You can eat until your jaw breaks while dedicating your life to proving a flat Earth, you can go base jumping off a cliff, or you can tattoo obscenities on your forehead. Or all of it at the same time. And it's perfectly acceptable as an action of autonomy and self-ownership.

Euthanasia, or suicide, is instead a problem of diminished capacity and whether or not suicide could ever be a decision of someone who is of sound mind. Much like we don't let babies walk into traffic, believe that a 9 year old is able to consent or allow severely mentally handicapped people the ability to refuse surgery -- having legal frameworks that don't encourage these things isn't about stripping away the right to self-ownership.

Re: Physically healthy 28-year-old woman schedules euthanasia due to depression

#57

Post by tibbydudeza »

bheadmaster wrote: post #25
croes wrote: post #6

So the other way aroun, physical sick and mentally healthy, isn't a problem? Isn't it about curability and pain?

I believe this is yet another case of people being skeptical about the very existence of mental illness. Euthanasia for incurable cancer patients is a no-brainer, but for incurable depression sufferers? Well, their bodies are healthy. What if it's just a phase they'll grow out of? Maybe they're just faking it? They should probably be more grateful for the gifts they've received from God, and they'll be happy. Maybe t…

>> What if it's just a phase they'll grow out of?

Nonsense - you clearly never had somebody close to you suffer from it. My daughter suffers from depression - it is not a state of mind or a funk you can snap out of.

Re: Physically healthy 28-year-old woman schedules euthanasia due to depression

#58

Post by i_am_programmer »

It's disheartening so many don't see the brain as a physical part of ourselves, just the mental. To describe this individual as suffering from "crippling depression" but also "physically healthy" when they clearly suffer from long term mental health problems feels like an oxymoron.

I'm not sure for what reason people think everyone needs to be alive and live long natural lives. If she doesn't end her life humanely and in the comfort of trained professionals, she can just simply do it at home in a far more unpleasant way. Hope it all goes well for them.

Re: Physically healthy 28-year-old woman schedules euthanasia due to depression

#59

Post by arrowsmith »

rschiavone wrote: post #39
iagooar wrote: post #5

I am terrified of the thought of legally killing people and this article has made me feel quite odd, even slightly sick I would say. My gut just screams at me: this is wrong. And I cannot help. The rational arguments do not convince me at all. Call me old fashioned or whatever but this is how I feel about it, and since there is an article about this I imagine that there might be certain interest in this being out of…

If a person has tried every other option and there is still no end to their pain, either physical or psychological, they would sooner or later try to end their life anyway. It is in the best interest of everybody to offer assisted suicide at a set time and date instead of taking the matter into their own hands and leaving family, friends and first responders with the trauma of discovering a body.

Except it won't stop with people who are truly living with unsolvable pain. You're painfully naive if you can't see that.

What's the limiting principle here exactly? If we normalize the idea that suicide is a solution to any problem, it's inevitably going to start being used as a "solution" for more and more problems: treatable illness, poverty, old age, disability, dependence on those who'd rather not shoulder the burden of caring for you.

It's already happening.

Re: Physically healthy 28-year-old woman schedules euthanasia due to depression

#60

Post by bheadmaster »

Jenk wrote: post #26
bheadmaster wrote: post #9

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> You have to make an argument that freedom is inherently good, which is not obvious to me Your next sentence holds that assumption as obvious: > I think it's good to force people to do things in many situations Why do you think you should have freedom to even think, let alone decide, what is good for other people?

"You're not allowed to rape" is a pretty strong example.

"You're not allowed" implies that someone else has the freedom to decide what is and is not allowed.

All roads lead to freedom. There can be no tyranny without freedom to tyrannize - there's just no way around it.

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