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'Lavender': The AI machine directing Israel's bombing in Gaza

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Re: 'Lavender': The AI machine directing Israel's bombing in Gaza

#251

Post by _a_a_a_ »

snird wrote: post #156
Quanttek wrote: post #108

Years ago, scholars (such as Didier Bigo) have already raised concerns about the targeting of individuals merely based on (indirect) association with a "terrorist" or "criminal". Originally used in the context of surveillance (see Snowden revelations), such systems would target anyone who would be e.g. less than 3-steps away from an identified individual, thereby removing any sense of due process or targeted surveill…

[flagged]

> It is very convenient to criticize it when you're not in it

Israel 'criticised' Hamas for their monstrous attack six months ago, started a war over it. Perhaps you're saying Israel should have just accepted it?

You know, perhaps this whole mess Israel is now involved in is a product of its own behaviour, and killing of loads more Palestinians is not likely to bring peace but further hate and evil.

Re: 'Lavender': The AI machine directing Israel's bombing in Gaza

#254

Post by contemporary343 »

I’m really not sure why this got flagged. It seemed like a well sourced and technology-focused article. Independent of this particular conflict, such automated decision making has long been viewed as inevitable. If even a small fraction of what is being reported is accurate it is extraordinarily disturbing.

Re: 'Lavender': The AI machine directing Israel's bombing in Gaza

#255

Post by HDThoreaun »

goethes_kind wrote: post #186

Israel's evil keeps taking me by surprise. I guess when people go down the path of dehumanization there are truly no limits to what they are ready to do. But what is even sadder is that the supposedly morally superior western world is entirely bribed and blackmailed to stand behind Israel. And then you have countries like Germany where you get thrown in jail for being upset at Israel.

It's been pretty clear to me for a while now that Israel's long term plan for the Palestinians is to expel them all. Starvation isnt a requirement for that, but it is probably the path of least resistance. I will say that its happening a lot faster than I expected though, Israel definitely taking advantage of the situation here.

Re: 'Lavender': The AI machine directing Israel's bombing in Gaza

#256

Post by dang »

JeremyNT wrote: post #138
skilled wrote: post #103

The Guardian has this story on the front page also, they were given details about it pre-publishing, https://www.theguardian.com/world/2024/apr/03/israel-gaza-ai... And, personally, I think that stories like this are of public interest - while I won’t ask for it directly, I hope the flag is removed and the discussion can happen.

This is the now-flagged to death HN thread on the Guardian version [0] I would hope they can be unflagged and merged, this appears to be an important story about a novel use of technology. [0] https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=39917727

Yes. We've merged that thread hither.

Re: 'Lavender': The AI machine directing Israel's bombing in Gaza

#258

Post by pixl97 »

CommieBobDole wrote: post #128
Quanttek wrote: post #108

Years ago, scholars (such as Didier Bigo) have already raised concerns about the targeting of individuals merely based on (indirect) association with a "terrorist" or "criminal". Originally used in the context of surveillance (see Snowden revelations), such systems would target anyone who would be e.g. less than 3-steps away from an identified individual, thereby removing any sense of due process or targeted surveill…

It's also interesting (and I guess typical for end-users of software) how quickly and easily something like this goes from "Here's a tool you can use as an information input when deciding who to target" to "I dunno, computer says these are the people we need to kill, let's get to it". In the Guardian article, an IDF spokesperson says it exists and is only used as the former, and I'm sure that's what was intended and…

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Computer_says_no

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Computers_Don%27t_Argue

Re: 'Lavender': The AI machine directing Israel's bombing in Gaza

#259

Post by r721 »

dang wrote: post #256
JeremyNT wrote: post #138

Earlier quoted context omitted.

This is the now-flagged to death HN thread on the Guardian version [0] I would hope they can be unflagged and merged, this appears to be an important story about a novel use of technology. [0] https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=39917727

Yes. We've merged that thread hither.

There's another dupe thread: https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=39919109

Re: 'Lavender': The AI machine directing Israel's bombing in Gaza

#260

Post by acdha »

supposemaybe wrote: post #64
dariosalvi78 wrote: post #32

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Definitely Palestinians are not going to forget this.

Em, I think you mean any reasonable minded human that walks the planet.

Yes, but specifically the Palestinian impact is why it’s such a terrible policy for Israel unless you assume their goal is perpetual war. Most people do not want to kill other people but each innocent killed like this is leaving behind friends, family, and neighbors who will want vengeance and some fraction of them will decide they need to resort to violence because the other mechanisms aren’t being used. Watching this happen has been incredibly depressing as you can pretty much mathematically predict a revenge period measured in decades.
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