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Canoo spent double its annual revenue on the CEO's private jet

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Re: Canoo spent double its annual revenue on the CEO's private jet

#161

Post by zardo »

bionsystem wrote: post #117
Solvency wrote: post #104

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Can someone explain why people try to make new cars from the ground up, rather than "fork" a base platform from GM/Toyota/KIA/whoever with a different design and little features? This happens in literally every other market and industry. hell, just look at PCs and laptops. Like why can't a Canoo or Rivian license a base EV platform and come up with their own chassis design, infotainment system, and other little thing…

It does happen, for example Paccar is a truck designer and sells licenses (apparently they also manufacture trucks but I think they used to only design them, although I'm not sure). I think some european makers do that as well and I would be surprised if Ford or GM doesn't. At least GM planned to buy (not sell) designs to Nikola if they ever managed to finish one (which I think they didn't in time for the deal to go…

Paccar builds and sells trucks, not a license to build them. Other companies buy those add their own equipment (cranes, concrete mixers, etc) and resell them.

Light duty truck and van builders e.g. Ford and GM do the same thing but mostly for companies building RVs rather than commercial equipment.

Re: Canoo spent double its annual revenue on the CEO's private jet

#162

Post by malfist »

drexlspivey wrote: post #157
malfist wrote: post #88

Earlier quoted context omitted.

A bit boring? Seems like straight up embezzlement.

So I’m assuming you’re paying for plane tickets out of pocket when going on a business trip. Otherwise it would be embezzlement right?

My company pays for my plane tickets, but it's not booking flights on my personal airplane, which I get to set the rates for.

Re: Canoo spent double its annual revenue on the CEO's private jet

#163

Post by TRDRVR »

blackhawkC17 wrote: post #26

If the reimbursements were solely for corporate travel, it might not be a concern. The CEO here sold his previous company for $6.5 billion [1], so he already owned the jet before starting Canoo. The company reimburses him for corporate travel on it. What's concerning is that Canoo is stacking big losses and living on the edge...it seems like excessive spending for a company that hasn't even made a dime of profit. But…

I think the real issue here is that a CEO who nobody has heard of and is doing a bad job running the company claims that he needs to fly private as a business expense.

It's one think for Zuck or Tim Cook to claim that flying commercial would be dangerous and a waste of time, but the way that attitude has filtered down to very small companies is astounding (especially given the outsized negative impact private jet travel has on the rest of us).

Any reasonable board for a public company that size and a CEO that unrecognizable should at most reimburse first class fare and if the CEO wants to fly private, the delta can come from personal funds.

Re: Canoo spent double its annual revenue on the CEO's private jet

#164

Post by jeffbee »

diggan wrote: post #7

> Under a deal reached in November 2020, Canoo reimburses Aquila Family Ventures, an entity owned by the CEO (Tony Aquila), for use of an aircraft. In 2023, Canoo spent $1.7 million on this reimbursement — that’s double the amount of revenue it generated. Canoo paid Aquila Family Ventures $1.3 million in 2022 and $1.8 million in 2021 for use of the aircraft. I'm surprised there are any employees left at the company.…

This is no unheard of. I worked at a company where the CEO got an interest-free loan from the company to buy his own jet, then charged the company to use it.

Of course that individual later pled guilty to a variety of federal crimes, so :shrug:

Re: Canoo spent double its annual revenue on the CEO's private jet

#165

Post by wongarsu »

Solvency wrote: post #142
Powdering7082 wrote: post #58

Earlier quoted context omitted.

yes it's clickbait-y, but it also seems a bit like it's burying the lede with the fact that the CEO is self dealing on top of it. > Canoo reimburses Aquila Family Ventures, an entity owned by the CEO, for use of an aircraft.

Imagine if all salaried employees working from an office created a personal LLC to own their car, and then had their work compensate them by reimbursing each employees LLC. Would that pass muster?

If it's cheaper for the company than leasing or renting cars somewhere else, why not?

Presumably you hire the employee for their time and expertise, not because they own a car and offer its use for company travel below market rate. (That does happen in many industries, but that's a market distortion we should look down on, not a yardstick for what's right)

Re: Canoo spent double its annual revenue on the CEO's private jet

#166

Post by efnx »

rvnx wrote: post #51
efnx wrote: post #27

Earlier quoted context omitted.

And they say “if you don’t like it, leave!”. And so now we live in New Zealand.

How is it there ? Are earthquake and food (and mosquitoes in the bushes) as bad as the rumours say ? (serious question about the first 2)

Earthquakes - so far so good, but I grew up in LA and lived through multiple large-ish quakes (Northridge). One big difference is that many small rural towns only have one road in or out, so a quake could block the road, leaving you stranded, possibly without power. This is the case along the west coast of the South Island.

Food - groceries are pricey! It was surprisingly expensive given the lower wages here. CA seems to be catching up though!

Mosquitoes - comparable to LA, less than Sonoma County. Smaller too. But here on the South Island we also have sandflies. They vary by region. West Coast has them bad in some remote spots.

Re: Canoo spent double its annual revenue on the CEO's private jet

#167

Post by sofixa »

flyingpenguin wrote: post #155
Solvency wrote: post #104

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Can someone explain why people try to make new cars from the ground up, rather than "fork" a base platform from GM/Toyota/KIA/whoever with a different design and little features? This happens in literally every other market and industry. hell, just look at PCs and laptops. Like why can't a Canoo or Rivian license a base EV platform and come up with their own chassis design, infotainment system, and other little thing…

I suspect, starting from the ground up is part of why people are so interested in these companies. The ICE car market is a massive market, which taking a part of required massive long term investment, and would result in you being relegated to just some minor side note. Even Toyota one of the longest biggest players is still seen as kinda "new" compared to BMW and VW, let alone hyundai which is basically a massive st…

Why would anyone think that the current ICE manufacturers will just sit idly by and not get out EV designs at some point? Either on their own, or in collaboration with other legacy manufacturers? They have existing brand loyalty, existing relationships, supply chains, dealership networks etc. etc. that they can make use of even if their designs aren't as good as brand new entrants (and that's assuming brand new entrants can actually scale up quality manufacturing, which so far they haven't been able to).

Re: Canoo spent double its annual revenue on the CEO's private jet

#168

Post by blackhawkC17 »

TRDRVR wrote: post #163
blackhawkC17 wrote: post #26

If the reimbursements were solely for corporate travel, it might not be a concern. The CEO here sold his previous company for $6.5 billion [1], so he already owned the jet before starting Canoo. The company reimburses him for corporate travel on it. What's concerning is that Canoo is stacking big losses and living on the edge...it seems like excessive spending for a company that hasn't even made a dime of profit. But…

I think the real issue here is that a CEO who nobody has heard of and is doing a bad job running the company claims that he needs to fly private as a business expense. It's one think for Zuck or Tim Cook to claim that flying commercial would be dangerous and a waste of time, but the way that attitude has filtered down to very small companies is astounding (especially given the outsized negative impact private jet tra…

I agree. It's one thing for the CEO of a large, profitable company to be flying private, but for a small, loss-making company, it feels off.

The guy is already ultra-rich...he might as well pay for those flights himself to show solidarity with shareholders. But it's up to Canoo shareholders to decide that, not me.

Re: Canoo spent double its annual revenue on the CEO's private jet

#169

Post by acdha »

drexlspivey wrote: post #157
malfist wrote: post #88

Earlier quoted context omitted.

A bit boring? Seems like straight up embezzlement.

So I’m assuming you’re paying for plane tickets out of pocket when going on a business trip. Otherwise it would be embezzlement right?

He’s buying air travel from himself. Unless he’s undercutting the commercial carriers, that means the company is spending more than it needs to with the difference going to his pockets.

It’d be much cleaner ethically for him to get reimbursed the cost of a business class ticket and pay for his jet out of pocket if he can’t abide flying with the little people.

Re: Canoo spent double its annual revenue on the CEO's private jet

#170

Post by ilrwbwrkhv »

blackhawkC17 wrote: post #26

If the reimbursements were solely for corporate travel, it might not be a concern. The CEO here sold his previous company for $6.5 billion [1], so he already owned the jet before starting Canoo. The company reimburses him for corporate travel on it. What's concerning is that Canoo is stacking big losses and living on the edge...it seems like excessive spending for a company that hasn't even made a dime of profit. But…

I am sure these companies are a massive money laundering operation. What does Solera even do or ever did? Prior to the acquisitions?
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