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Canoo spent double its annual revenue on the CEO's private jet

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Re: Canoo spent double its annual revenue on the CEO's private jet

#101

Post by neom »

oytis wrote: post #86
dgrin91 wrote: post #36

The headline is relatively clickbait-y. Its double their revenue because their revenue is basically 0. Their actual expenses are hundreds of millions, of which this 1.7 million is a drop in the bucket. Once their upfront expenses are paid they will (presumably) be making hundreds of millions/billions in revenue, which means this 1.7m is not particularly important. You can talk about standard complaints of CEOs with p…

Still, why would you use a private jet if your company is not only not profitable, but also doesn't generate meaningful revenue? You're not spending money you've earned, you're spending borrowed money.

If his net worth is $400MM+, his insurance my very well require him to fly private.

Re: Canoo spent double its annual revenue on the CEO's private jet

#102

Post by lnxg33k1 »

blackhawkC17 wrote: post #26

If the reimbursements were solely for corporate travel, it might not be a concern. The CEO here sold his previous company for $6.5 billion [1], so he already owned the jet before starting Canoo. The company reimburses him for corporate travel on it. What's concerning is that Canoo is stacking big losses and living on the edge...it seems like excessive spending for a company that hasn't even made a dime of profit. But…

Its concerning the conflict of interest, it can be crystal clear as going to make public pay for playing at your own golf court, but to be is baffling just how public populace is constantly scrutinised for ethics but seem that the rich can crap all over the world and no one cares

Re: Canoo spent double its annual revenue on the CEO's private jet

#103

Post by lanstein »

eszed wrote: post #24

I slightly mis-read the headline. Here's what's going on: >Canoo reimburses Aquila Family Ventures, an entity owned by the CEO, for use of an aircraft. In 2023, Canoo spent $1.7 million on this reimbursement. CEO owns a plane. CEO uses the plane (for business, one presumes). Business reimburses CEO for plane. That looks like a poor use of funds, but not necessarily self-dealing? I mean, in their position he should pr…

Can you tell me what travel system allows that?

Re: Canoo spent double its annual revenue on the CEO's private jet

#104

Post by Solvency »

Climato wrote: post #43
blackhawkC17 wrote: post #26

If the reimbursements were solely for corporate travel, it might not be a concern. The CEO here sold his previous company for $6.5 billion [1], so he already owned the jet before starting Canoo. The company reimburses him for corporate travel on it. What's concerning is that Canoo is stacking big losses and living on the edge...it seems like excessive spending for a company that hasn't even made a dime of profit. But…

You need at least 400 Million to enter the car manufacturer market. The investment does sound absolutely reasonable at this point.

Can someone explain why people try to make new cars from the ground up, rather than "fork" a base platform from GM/Toyota/KIA/whoever with a different design and little features?

This happens in literally every other market and industry. hell, just look at PCs and laptops.

Like why can't a Canoo or Rivian license a base EV platform and come up with their own chassis design, infotainment system, and other little things to differentiate themselves?

why does it HAVE to be all or nothing?

Re: Canoo spent double its annual revenue on the CEO's private jet

#105

Post by ricardobayes »

benjlcox wrote: post #46
dgrin91 wrote: post #36

The headline is relatively clickbait-y. Its double their revenue because their revenue is basically 0. Their actual expenses are hundreds of millions, of which this 1.7 million is a drop in the bucket. Once their upfront expenses are paid they will (presumably) be making hundreds of millions/billions in revenue, which means this 1.7m is not particularly important. You can talk about standard complaints of CEOs with p…

$1.7 million is 1-3 employees working to ship your product. When you're company is on the edge of collapse you should have your priorities straight. Diverting company resources to your own private jet is a preposterous use of resources and, imo, speaks volumes about where Canoo is headed.

Please drop me a line if you know of any startup hiring for a 500k(ish) comp package.

Re: Canoo spent double its annual revenue on the CEO's private jet

#106

Post by [deleted] »

gruturo wrote: post #93
diggan wrote: post #7

> Under a deal reached in November 2020, Canoo reimburses Aquila Family Ventures, an entity owned by the CEO (Tony Aquila), for use of an aircraft. In 2023, Canoo spent $1.7 million on this reimbursement — that’s double the amount of revenue it generated. Canoo paid Aquila Family Ventures $1.3 million in 2022 and $1.8 million in 2021 for use of the aircraft. I'm surprised there are any employees left at the company.…

If he actually uses the jet for Canoo-related business, this is not unreasonable. Assuming those trips may eventually lead to business deals, and that the amounts reimbursed are in line with free market prices, it is advantageous to Canoo. Their CEO could be x% "more effective" (I know how abstract that sounds), ultimately benefiting the company, and maybe they even got a good deal ("hey, I own a jet, and it has to f…

[deleted]

Re: Canoo spent double its annual revenue on the CEO's private jet

#107

Post by evandale »

blackhawkC17 wrote: post #85
pbhjpbhj wrote: post #68

Earlier quoted context omitted.

It's a shell company used to dodge taxes, presumably? Or something similarly nefarious; avoiding liabilities or whatever. Not really a company but a legal instrument.

> It's a shell company used to dodge taxes, presumably? It's a holding company for the CEO's assets. Virtually everyone worth $10 million+ has one. When and why did people become so conspiratorial and see boogeymen in everything they don't grasp?

It's hasn't been a conspiracy theory since the Panama papers came out. Everyone is now aware of the extent rich people go to use tax havens and are rightfully upset. They make record profits, encourage irresponsible consumerism, and don't even pay their fair share for the damage they inflict upon the world.

https://www.cbc.ca/news/politics/panama-paradise-pandora-pap...

Furthermore there's a reason rich people flock to places like Delaware, Washington, or California. Those states all have tax schemes that allow the wealthy to pay the least amount of taxes.

Hell us rubes even suffer through coach so that the ultra wealthy's luxury jets are subsidized.

https://www.businessinsider.com/ultra-wealthy-private-flyers...

We understand exactly what they're doing, just because we don't agree with it doesn't make us ignorant or uneducated.

Re: Canoo spent double its annual revenue on the CEO's private jet

#108

Post by JoshTriplett »

Solvency wrote: post #104
Climato wrote: post #43

Earlier quoted context omitted.

You need at least 400 Million to enter the car manufacturer market. The investment does sound absolutely reasonable at this point.

Can someone explain why people try to make new cars from the ground up, rather than "fork" a base platform from GM/Toyota/KIA/whoever with a different design and little features? This happens in literally every other market and industry. hell, just look at PCs and laptops. Like why can't a Canoo or Rivian license a base EV platform and come up with their own chassis design, infotainment system, and other little thing…

How enthusiastic do you think those companies would be if someone came to them wanting to license their design perpetually and use it to compete with them? And even if that is something they're willing to do (which they might be), the terms would then make it difficult to ever do something that isn't based on that platform, since the manufacturer whose design is licensed would likely object that the new design was still based in some way on the old one.

The analogy in the PC world would not be "license a design from an ODM like Compal or Quanta", it'd be "license a design from Dell or Lenovo".

That in itself suggests a potential market: perhaps there's room for an ODM in the automotive space?

Re: Canoo spent double its annual revenue on the CEO's private jet

#109

Post by alberth »

> The company generated $886,000 in revenue

Plenty of companies spend more than that on just AWS egress fees.

I’m not saying money spent on a private jet is right or wrong.

But when a company is not profitable, you could compare this to anything. Like the headline could have easily been “Canoo spent double its annual revenue on AWS egress fees”

Re: Canoo spent double its annual revenue on the CEO's private jet

#110

Post by jonathankoren »

ein0p wrote: post #92
malfist wrote: post #88

Earlier quoted context omitted.

A bit boring? Seems like straight up embezzlement.

It’s only embezzlement if board/investors didn’t know. This definitely is something the board would have to approve. As a former exec though I think it’s distasteful to require such things before significant profitability. Business class is fine. Pre-revenue, coach is fine too.

TBF boards are famously insular and self serving, with everyone being on each other’s boards.
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