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Novo Nordisk facing pressure as study finds $1k drug can be made for $5

fortune.com

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Re: Novo Nordisk facing pressure as study finds $1k drug can be made for $5

#161

Post by lxgr »

lxgr wrote: post #28
karles wrote: post #9

Producing it is not the hard part. Researching it is... And you are not paid for your research "up front". It's added to the cost afterwards.

On top of research, FDA approval doesn’t come for free either.

Are the downvotes expression of disapproval with the FDA process or disagreement with the assertion that it's become slow and expensive enough to pose an ethical problem (e.g. for people with diseases for which a cure exists but is still waiting for approval)?

Or does anybody actually believe FDA approval is very easy and cheap to come by these days?

Re: Novo Nordisk facing pressure as study finds $1k drug can be made for $5

#162

Post by aaomidi »

pstrateman wrote: post #130
ToucanLoucan wrote: post #113

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> Frankly the US pays for the cost of the research while the rest of the world just pays for the cost of production. Oh come the fuck on, this has been the talking point since the early 2000's. Surely nobody still believes this horse shit. Phizer by itself raked in 50 billion last year alone.

Pfizer's world wide net income was $2.12bn USD in 2023. I guarantee you 100% of that came from the united states.

Okay? Then if the US starts changing its policy they won’t make stupid deals with the rest of the world then.

Re: Novo Nordisk facing pressure as study finds $1k drug can be made for $5

#163

Post by [deleted] »

Scandiravian wrote: post #23

I think the complexity of the issue isn't really reflected by the article. The most obvious points that are missing are the risks associated with developing a new drug, the costs of research, and the regulatory requirements from the FDA Since pharmaceutical companies are, for the most part, publicly traded they're beholden to stock holders to create a profit. If they stop doing that they're in trouble If the ability…

[deleted]

Re: Novo Nordisk facing pressure as study finds $1k drug can be made for $5

#164

Post by aaomidi »

Scandiravian wrote: post #121
lostlogin wrote: post #95

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The older products are much more expensive in the US too. It’s price gouging, and that’s when regulation has been imposed. The newer products are cheaper elsewhere in the world. The US is getting ripped off by big pharma.

First of, I think that health-care prices in the US are horrible and have terrible consequences for patients However, the blame doesn't lie with pharmaceutical companies. They're not selling their products cheaper elsewhere because they hate the US and love other countries They're doing it because the US has created a system that benefits corporations more than its citizens. If blame needs to be distributed it lies w…

And they’re actively lobbying to keep it that way.

Re: Novo Nordisk facing pressure as study finds $1k drug can be made for $5

#165

Post by ikr678 »

zachmu wrote: post #111
lostlogin wrote: post #87

Earlier quoted context omitted.

So why is older insulin more expensive in the US than elsewhere, by a large margin? https://www.visualcapitalist.com/cost-of-insulin-by-country/ https://www.rand.org/pubs/research_reports/RRA788-2.html https://worldpopulationreview.com/country-rankings/cost-of-i...

Because almost nobody actually pays those prices > One key limitation of this study is that most of our analyses used manufacturer gross prices, not manufacturer net prices after rebates and other discounts are applied.16 Given the generally competitive insulin market, rebates in the United States are substantial (Mulcahy, Schwam, et al., 2021; Dickson et al., 2023). After applying a 76 percent manufacturer gross-to-…

This falls into a greater pattern of behavior in the us that I have noticed where pricing for almost everything is completely opaque. The price on the menu for a burger is not what comes out on the bill (tax, gratuity).

The price for healthcare is beyond understanding for mortals. The price for drugs, again you and your neighbour could be paying something completely different for the same medication. The actual cost to your wallet for university? Who know, everyone seems to get different levels of subsidy and scholarship. Visa Cash App - you can make the same purchase on two different days and pay different prices, unique only to you.

I find it incredibly exhausting to visit the US and navigate all these pricing systems, I dont know how you have let this become a psychological status quo.

Re: Novo Nordisk facing pressure as study finds $1k drug can be made for $5

#166

Post by pfdietz »

Ekaros wrote: post #157
pfdietz wrote: post #154

Earlier quoted context omitted.

They have monopsonies. The drug maker has a choice of either losing some operating profit or going along with the price they set. The free riding is in these countries not paying a price that pays their share of the development cost of the drug.

These companies are not selling drugs at loss in these countries. And these countries are not forcing the sale of drugs in the first place. The companies choose to take some profit over none. That does not make smarter countries that do negotiation anyway free riders.

Indeed, they are not selling the drugs at a price that is below their marginal costs. But they are also not selling drugs at a price that compensates them for the development cost, including the cost of drugs that didn't reach the market. They are free riding on this latter part.

Re: Novo Nordisk facing pressure as study finds $1k drug can be made for $5

#167

Post by blackhawkC17 »

gtvwill wrote: post #103
briandear wrote: post #79

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Should they not profit on that capital invested for that research? Do landlords drop rents when the loan is paid off? Of course not, they’re going to price rents what the market supports. Competition is what makes markets work. Invent a drug? And someone else invents a similar drug? Prices will go down.

Rental markets rooted where I am. Fails to provide for society the purpose it exists for. So yeah if your saying big pharma is the same sure I'm on board. Profit enough to survive. But don't take more than your worth. Tbh profiting off medicine is about as low as profiting off weapons manufacturing. You literally make money out of the misery of others. Thank f#@k I live in a country that has free healthcare. The conc…

[dead]

Re: Novo Nordisk facing pressure as study finds $1k drug can be made for $5

#168

Post by votepaunchy »

pstrateman wrote: post #130
ToucanLoucan wrote: post #113

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> Frankly the US pays for the cost of the research while the rest of the world just pays for the cost of production. Oh come the fuck on, this has been the talking point since the early 2000's. Surely nobody still believes this horse shit. Phizer by itself raked in 50 billion last year alone.

Pfizer's world wide net income was $2.12bn USD in 2023. I guarantee you 100% of that came from the united states.

Pfizer net income for 2023 by quarter. After taking in 10s of billions in vaccine profits this certainly looks like some fun accounting.

2023-12-31 $-3,369 2023-09-30 $-2,382 2023-06-30 $2,327 2023-03-31 $5,543

https://www.macrotrends.net/stocks/charts/PFE/pfizer/net-inc...

Re: Novo Nordisk facing pressure as study finds $1k drug can be made for $5

#169

Post by Wytwwww »

FireBeyond wrote: post #146
pstrateman wrote: post #97

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Only the last one makes the distinction between modern synthetics and basic insulin. Frankly the US pays for the cost of the research while the rest of the world just pays for the cost of production. If you want to fix the cost of insulin products (and many other drugs) in the US you need to figure out how to make everybody else pay for the true costs. Edit: also your last source there doesn't even know what it's tal…

> Frankly the US pays for the cost of the research while the rest of the world just pays for the cost of production. Top 10 pharma companies, 5/10 are US (2 UK, 2 Swiss, 1 French). 4 of the top 6 for profit margins (from 43%(!) to 19%) are US (Merck is the only outlier, 9th, at 10%). 4 of the top 5 for Sales and Marketing Spend (both on raw dollars and as a percentage of revenue) are US. 3 of the bottom 5 for R&D spe…

That's a 10 year old article. Although if we rank by market cap top 6 are from the US these days (by revenue 5 out 10 seem to be European) so not much has seemingly changed (besides Novo Nordisk becoming the second most valuable pharma company out of nowhere)

Re: Novo Nordisk facing pressure as study finds $1k drug can be made for $5

#170

Post by rufus_foreman »

lostlogin wrote: post #87
zachmu wrote: post #73

Earlier quoted context omitted.

When people complain about being forced to pay thousands a month for insulin, they're talking about the newest synthetic insulins that were developed very recently at substantial costs. They could take the older insulins for $50 a month, no one is stopping them. It's just that those older products are less convenient.

So why is older insulin more expensive in the US than elsewhere, by a large margin? https://www.visualcapitalist.com/cost-of-insulin-by-country/ https://www.rand.org/pubs/research_reports/RRA788-2.html https://worldpopulationreview.com/country-rankings/cost-of-i...

>> So why is older insulin more expensive in the US than elsewhere, by a large margin?

Here you go kid: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Free-rider_problem

Read that, and then you can explain to me the answer to your question.

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