Well duh - when something is/feels wrong those with options bail first. Not exactly rocket science
When new hires get paid more, top performers resign first
121–130 of 225 posts
Re: When new hires get paid more, top performers resign first
#122Earlier quoted context omitted.
This just tells me you’re not well versed in sales and marketing. Learn those first (specially direct response) and the other pieces will glide into place with less effort.
What are some good resources to learn this?
Unfortunately, experience. A good dose of people skills help, but you need to know what makes real money move and get contacts in your area. Find someone who has succeeded in your area, and try to get into those circles.
Re: When new hires get paid more, top performers resign first
#123I just had a very valuable teammate quit this week from lack of salary progression. New-ish grads are making more than him for much lesser jobs. The business refused to do even a token salary increase because of the ‘economic climate’ Now a critical project won’t happen on time, which will cost the company many magnitudes more in revenue than it would have cost them with a token increase. Oops.
Are you all extremely underpaid or something? Or how are new grads getting so much in a down market? I'm decently experienced saw lots of relatively low paying jobs in general
Apparently I'm underpaid lol, someone upthread says "Friend getting paid $200k more than me" and I've never been paid $200k in my life
Re: When new hires get paid more, top performers resign first
#124Earlier quoted context omitted.
Are you all extremely underpaid or something? Or how are new grads getting so much in a down market? I'm decently experienced saw lots of relatively low paying jobs in general
What market is down?
The regular software engineering market is very rough to get jobs in right now, particularly at lower levels of experience
Re: When new hires get paid more, top performers resign first
#125Earlier quoted context omitted.
Not only is it an example of the idiotic decision making processes that companies use that are not effective in the long run, it demonstrates how they are happy to pit employees against one another. It is awkward for a person to know that they make substantially more than coworkers. It forms a feeling of guilt and other negative feelings. But what are they supposed to do? Negotiate lower salaries when starting or aft…
> It is awkward This is why I don't discuss my salary, nor do I want to know what my coworkers make. It's not information that is terribly useful, but can make for very awkward situations. I do want to know whether or not I'm making a salary that is in line with the norms in my area, but I can easily find that information without knowing what any individual is making.
> I can easily find that information without knowing what any individual is making.
How do you usually find that information?
Re: When new hires get paid more, top performers resign first
#126This is one of the reasons I loved Netflix. Each year they would say "to get new people in the door with your level experience, we had to offer them $XXX. Therefore we are raising you to $XXX." Some years I got 25%+ raises. Netflix understood this like no one else.
Would they also do the opposite now that the tech labor market is going sour? " We got 1000 qualified applicants and a bunch accepted our low ball offers, your salary is reduced by 25% "
As far as I saw they never lowered salaries. They would say "the market is down this year, so you won't get a rise, but you're still at the top of your market". You could always go out an interview and come back with new data if you got a better offer.
Re: When new hires get paid more, top performers resign first
#127Earlier quoted context omitted.
[flagged]
I live in the US, have a decent-paying job, but I don't have any kids, and I got a vasectomy so it seems unlikely that I will have any kids. If something happens by accident (e.g. the vas deferens heals), my wife and I would almost certainly keep it and we'd be parents, but I don't think that's terribly likely. I actually do really like kids, I like my nieces and nephew, but the problem is that the value proposition…
> but the problem is that the value proposition for having kids is not terribly high. They're expensive, and time consuming
Yes but you get to pass the gift of life off to another person which I think is the greatest thing one person can do for another. It's a sacrifice so someone else will get to experience their first spring, their first love, the great works of art of humans past, etc.
>I don't think I'd be a terribly good parent, and I would prefer to avoid screwing up another human.
You sound like you'd be a great father. From a stranger who had their first 2 years ago with a second on the way, please reconsider your vasectomy. I can't stress the absolute joy and love it has brought my wife and I.
Re: When new hires get paid more, top performers resign first
#128Earlier quoted context omitted.
Yup! We were encouraged to take interviews at other companies for multiple reasons. One was to report back the offer as data for the HR team. They used that both in level setting new offers as well as making sure you got an appropriate raise. It was also because Netflix understood that if you found a better job, it was better for both you and Netflix to leave and take that job, because it meant that you weren't truly…
Sounds pretty ideal! But it also sounds like you're talking about all of this in the past tense... why did you end up leaving, if you don't mind me asking? :)
Had a baby and retired. :) Retirement didn't last though, now that both kids are in school I'm back at work. FWIW I would go back in a heartbeat if they had a role for me.
Re: When new hires get paid more, top performers resign first
#129I just had a very valuable teammate quit this week from lack of salary progression. New-ish grads are making more than him for much lesser jobs. The business refused to do even a token salary increase because of the ‘economic climate’ Now a critical project won’t happen on time, which will cost the company many magnitudes more in revenue than it would have cost them with a token increase. Oops.
I hate this shortsightedness of business leaders.
I’ve seen similar problems. Not wanting to give a raise to a critical person, and then having to replace them with 3 people. Not wanting to pay 10% more and ending up paying 300% more…
Re: When new hires get paid more, top performers resign first
#130Earlier quoted context omitted.
Not only is it an example of the idiotic decision making processes that companies use that are not effective in the long run, it demonstrates how they are happy to pit employees against one another. It is awkward for a person to know that they make substantially more than coworkers. It forms a feeling of guilt and other negative feelings. But what are they supposed to do? Negotiate lower salaries when starting or aft…
> It is awkward This is why I don't discuss my salary, nor do I want to know what my coworkers make. It's not information that is terribly useful, but can make for very awkward situations. I do want to know whether or not I'm making a salary that is in line with the norms in my area, but I can easily find that information without knowing what any individual is making.
> It's not information that is terribly useful
This opinion feels alien to me. Some of the most useful information you can have in a company is around salary/bonus/commission structures. From a purely self interested perspective, knowing this makes you a far better negotiator around review season. And from an organizational perspective, understanding what kind of things get people their bonus or commission goes a long way to understand what kind of decisions they make and how to influence them.
As a manager, though: thanks, employees with this perspective reduce the number of awkward meetings I might have.