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Math writing is dull when it neglects the human dimension

golem.ph.utexas.edu

141–150 of 186 posts

Re: Math writing is dull when it neglects the human dimension

#141

The best math book I've ever read -- which I think can completely transform somebody's appreciation of math -- was William Dunham's "Journey Through Genius - The Great Theorems of Mathematics." What this book did was place mathematics in human and historical context. It starts with Hippocrates' Quadrature of the Lune, then moves on to Euclid's proof of the Pythagorean theorem, and moves along through history all the…

My college advisor gifted me a copy when I graduated, and I passed it along to one of the best students that I had. Great book.

Re: Math writing is dull when it neglects the human dimension

#142
I don't know what's objectively "correct", but my favorite CS papers are the ones that try and be more entertaining to read.

Stuff like "Cheney on the MTA", or the "Lambda the Ultimate" papers are fun to read, while still dumping a lot of interesting information. I also think Lamports papers tend to be more fun simply because they use more tangible analogies for things rather than sticking with formalized mathematics.

I kind of view the overly dry, super-formal math/CS papers to be almost a form of gatekeeping. There's a lot of really useful information in a lot of papers, but people don't read them because they rely on a lot of formalisms and notation that are pretty dry to learn about. Sure, I know what a "comonad" and "endofunctor" is, and using terms like that can be useful, but I also think that it can sometimes be better to take a simpler, more grounded approach to things, or at least work with metaphors.

Re: Math writing is dull when it neglects the human dimension

#143

I think mathematics is in a good place with regards to tolerance of self-promotion. I do not think that we should put up with excessive hype in the name of "humanizing" papers. I do think that a lot of mathematicians do not provide enough detail or motivation for their arguments. Not necessarily motivation in the sense of "why is this important", but motivation in the sense of "we are beginning a three page proof. Le…

culture war aside, there are many other more accurate ways to say "details omitted for brevity" than "obviously" and "it is easy to see that"

this is also something that makes me want a more interactive publishing format, though i understand the good reasons to stick to the static quo. if it's easy to see, it shouldn't be too hard to write out in a collapsible sidebar for those interested

Re: Math writing is dull when it neglects the human dimension

#144

Earlier quoted context omitted.

This was my initial reaction as well, as I have complete disdain for the lowest common denominator approach to many things in modern society. But then something occurred to me - IMO one of the most well written scientific papers is Einstein's special relativity paper. [1] But it's absolutely a 'story mode' paper! A moderately educated individual could easily understand and follow the paper, even if they might not nec…

I don’t see this article argument for a “lowest common denominator” approach. For example, how is replacing “Let M be a complete Riemannian manifold, G a compact Lie group and P → M a principal G-bundle.” by “One of the main problems in gauge theory is understanding the geometry of the space of solutions of the Yang–Mills equations on a Riemannian manifold.” doing that? It gets rid of “Lie group” and “G-bundle”, but…

As someone who never took much advanced math or physics in school and really doesn't understand what either representation of that material is staying, personally I find the second example far, far more approachable because it is far more googleable!

If Gauge Theory is a concept required to relate to the other content in that sentence I've got no shot of knowing gauge theory is involved in the first example. I don't know what the arrow between P and M means. I'd have to look up what a G-bundle is. Its basically not clear to me which parts are syntax and which are proper nouns.

The example which reads more like prose than an equation expressed in terms of English words gives me much, much more context for where to begin reading about what I don't know.

Re: Math writing is dull when it neglects the human dimension

#145

Earlier quoted context omitted.

This was my initial reaction as well, as I have complete disdain for the lowest common denominator approach to many things in modern society. But then something occurred to me - IMO one of the most well written scientific papers is Einstein's special relativity paper. [1] But it's absolutely a 'story mode' paper! A moderately educated individual could easily understand and follow the paper, even if they might not nec…

I don’t see this article argument for a “lowest common denominator” approach. For example, how is replacing “Let M be a complete Riemannian manifold, G a compact Lie group and P → M a principal G-bundle.” by “One of the main problems in gauge theory is understanding the geometry of the space of solutions of the Yang–Mills equations on a Riemannian manifold.” doing that? It gets rid of “Lie group” and “G-bundle”, but…

One important element for me is that the framing should be as specific as possible.

The article's example, regrettably isn't the best example of this, but: by saying "one of the main problems..." the author (quite reasonably, not click-baiting) is trying to say "this paper is about something important and is worth reading, or at least reading the abstract". Unfortunately for me (not necessarily others) these kinds of context act as framing, so I am less likely to match to a similar case in a different domain.

Here's a CS example: let's just say you might have found a way to, say, compress the TLB or use fewer instructions to use it which speeds things up in most cases but slows them down in a few corner cases. You could start by talking about the problem of paging systems under high load or large RAM or something -- great!

But if you described a novel hashing architecture, later in the paper pointing out that it's "..useful, for example in a pager", I might read the paper and say "holy cow this would work well for this thing I'm working on".

That's why I prefer just the dry bones. I can hang whatever flesh I want onto them.

But I know not everybody is like that, and that's OK. The world isn't supposed to pander just to my need (though it should, dammit!)

Re: Math writing is dull when it neglects the human dimension

#146

I think mathematics is in a good place with regards to tolerance of self-promotion. I do not think that we should put up with excessive hype in the name of "humanizing" papers. I do think that a lot of mathematicians do not provide enough detail or motivation for their arguments. Not necessarily motivation in the sense of "why is this important", but motivation in the sense of "we are beginning a three page proof. Le…

> Not necessarily motivation in the sense of "why is this important", but motivation in the sense of "we are beginning a three page proof. Let me give you a paragraph to give you the outline so that you can fill in the details yourself, rather than having to read all of the details just to reconstruct the outline."

In graduate school this was the most frustrating aspect of paper reading (and writing). It makes sense why it exists however. Papers on mathematics in particular are laser targeted to a particular niche. As the science progresses you need more and more bespoke knowledge of previous work to even start the paper you're reading. There's an implicit assumption you've done your homework, so to speak, and authors likely feel there is no need to provide such a summary. Since, of course, if you don't have the pre-requisite knowledge the paper isn't targeted at you anyway.

Some of it of course is simply a pride thing. There have been many times I've felt the lack of exposition was a way to say "I'm better than you". I have no evidence this is the case but it would not surprise me.

Re: Math writing is dull when it neglects the human dimension

#147
post #119

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> Do you not realize that SAT might just be O(2^n) at best? Yes, but that's the worst case on all possible instances. Even with this worst case performance, there might be an algorithm that works on par with other algorithms that specialize only on certain instances. E.g. there can be an O(2^n) algorithm for general SAT which performs in O(n^(3/2)) on XORSAT. We simply don't understand the problem well enough to tell…

The average case is also O(n^2). You have a completely utopian idea about what might be computationally feasible. I don't even know what you are arguing. Certainly it is thinkable that SAT is somehow ridiculously simple to calculate, just in the same way that achieving simple and near free fusion energy is thinkable. It just isn't going to happen and speculating on it is pure science fiction.

> Certainly it is thinkable that SAT is somehow ridiculously simple to calculate, just in the same way that achieving simple and near free fusion energy is thinkable. It just isn't going to happen and speculating on it is pure science fiction.

These are, as I'm sure you know, utterly different. Nuclear fusion is real, 'simple' and 'near free' are engineering problems. If human civilization lasts long enough, and continues to progress technologically, we'll have that, for some value of 'simple' and 'near free'.

On the other hand, the conjecture that SAT is algorithmically feasible may be disproven, and in my opinion, will be. That would be "just isn't going to happen".

Re: Math writing is dull when it neglects the human dimension

#148
post #137

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> This may require “watering down” the results being described — stating corollaries or special cases instead of the full theorems in their maximal generality. Sometimes you may even need to leave out technical conditions required for the results to really be true. This is a trade off, don't you think? Without the marketing, the paper would be more complete and correct.

No, your exercpt is not complete and correct. "So, the introduction to a math paper should set the scene as simply as possible" The introduction is not the whole paper.

[deleted]

Re: Math writing is dull when it neglects the human dimension

#149

I think mathematics is in a good place with regards to tolerance of self-promotion. I do not think that we should put up with excessive hype in the name of "humanizing" papers. I do think that a lot of mathematicians do not provide enough detail or motivation for their arguments. Not necessarily motivation in the sense of "why is this important", but motivation in the sense of "we are beginning a three page proof. Le…

culture war aside, there are many other more accurate ways to say "details omitted for brevity" than "obviously" and "it is easy to see that" this is also something that makes me want a more interactive publishing format, though i understand the good reasons to stick to the static quo. if it's easy to see, it shouldn't be too hard to write out in a collapsible sidebar for those interested

Like everything in mathematics, "obvious" is a term of art. Broadly speaking, it refers to a fact, proof, consequence, which is necessary for the proof to advance, but which is already established elsewhere, so it does not in itself aid in understanding the proof being presented.

A proof is either providing a new result, or is proving an established result in a new way. Almost always, a proof will need other results, in a way that isn't "interesting" (another term of art). The point of introducing these results as "obvious" is basically to say "here is something which isn't proven by the proof I'm presenting, we need it, but there's no need to derive it to follow this proof", ideally, with a footnote. As language, it is a bit sly: if something is obvious in the normal sense, it will be left out.

It's a problem that the modern style is to elide anything obvious in this sense, rather than in the sense of "anyone who might reasonably read this paper may be expected to know this". But labeling these things as obvious isn't meant in the sense "if you don't know this, you're stupid or uninformed", or in fact "this will be instantly clear as soon as I mention it", it's meant to mean "if you were to follow the breadcrumbs and check up on the 'obvious' thing, it wouldn't help you much in following my proof, so take my word for it. Or, y'know, knock yourself out if this step is interesting to you".

Re: Math writing is dull when it neglects the human dimension

#150
post #137

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> This may require “watering down” the results being described — stating corollaries or special cases instead of the full theorems in their maximal generality. Sometimes you may even need to leave out technical conditions required for the results to really be true. This is a trade off, don't you think? Without the marketing, the paper would be more complete and correct.

No, your exercpt is not complete and correct. "So, the introduction to a math paper should set the scene as simply as possible" The introduction is not the whole paper.

If I have a salad and I water down just the dressing the whole salad is still worse, no? Unless you are saying the introduction isn't important, in which case why would you need to change it at all to make the paper more engaging?
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