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Smart people don't think others are stupid

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Re: Smart people don't think others are stupid

#51

Post by scarmig »

reitzensteinm wrote: post #40

Interesting choice including Republican and Democrat, there. I don't think they're stupid, but if someone identifies themselves as "a Republican" or "a Democrat", as opposed to "the Republican party best fits my views", or "I'm a registered Democrat", I pretty much write off any chance of having a decent political discussion with them. A large segment of the population follows politics the way they follow football, e…

Well, one argument is that politics is essentially a football game. The stakes are far, far higher, but fundamentally it comes down to all the institutions of a society self-organizing themselves into coalitions for the assumption or protection of power. "Reason" amounts to a way to mask rhetorical flourishes to convince dupes that they're morally better or smarter than the other side.

And if you're turning to the Wall Street Journal or New York Times to learn about the finer points of Nozick's critique of Rawlsian liberalism... well, then you're the dupe, even if it's of a "pox-on-both-your-houses" variety. Thinking too hard about whatever outrage-of-the-day Mitt or Obama has done is a similar waste of time--it's not that there isn't conceivably some correct position about whether eating a dog or strapping them to your roof reflects worse on your character, it's just that it's all a smokescreen.

Given that, I'd say you have to pick a side. If you end up rejecting politics because it isn't the Oxford debating society, you've essentially let the other side deprive your own side of a valuable resource. It might suck that you're stuck in a game not of your own choosing, but if someone's kicking you on the ground, you don't quietly accept it because they're not following Marquees of Queensbury rules.

Re: Smart people don't think others are stupid

#52

Post by Zenst »

Smart people don't think others are stupid as the truely smart know that others are stupid.

Thinking is not 100% knowing. Think about that.

Also there are two types of stupid, those that are naturaly gifeted in such arts and those that work at it. It is the later that are truely stupid and the former who are just limited.

Re: Smart people don't think others are stupid

#53

Post by donaq »

That's provably wrong. In the first place, both his definitions of "smart" and "stupid" are wrong according to the dictionary. You can't just redefine words so that they suit your argument. If that's an acceptable approach, I can just as easily say all living humans are stupid by defining "stupid" as "not Einstein".

Secondly, even if we allow that his private definitions be used for the purposes of this argument, he's still wrong. People do exhibit consistent behavioral tendencies, after all. Some people consistently think things through, while others consistently jump to conclusions. So I think there is pretty good justification in applying the heuristic of thinking a person is stupid if he consistently jumps to conclusions.

I hate to say this, because I have much respect for Derek Sivers, but this post was pretty stupid.

Re: Smart people don't think others are stupid

#54

Post by georgieporgie »

I think it's a good attitude to take, particularly when dealing with peers. Giving others the benefit of the doubt and not assuming that everyone should know everything you know goes a long way toward making the world a better and more tolerable place. Also, when discussing matters of principle it's extremely valuable to be able to understand and argue for the opposition, rather than merely dismissing opposing views as 'stupid'.

However, the author is fundamentally wrong. There are stupid people. I didn't believe it until I got out of my college/career track and met a few of them.

Re: Smart people don't think others are stupid

#55

Post by bobbles »

tinylittlefish wrote: post #20
SatvikBeri wrote: post #18

Earlier quoted context omitted.

But people tend to fixate on their first impression of others. It's very common to see someone do something stupid once, and then assume they're stupid forever-or the opposite. It's definitely worth recognizing the first impression bias, and doing your best to fight it.

I agree with you. A good example of this is what we experience when driving. If someone cuts me off, my instinctive reaction is to think, "What a moron!" Which is unfair, of course: it may have been a one-time stupid mistake. Even if you think you see a pattern, someone who seems stupid at something may just be outside of their comfort zone/talent area. In another field, they may be quite smart.

Another example would be when a developer who build a framework at an organisation has left the company.

90% of the time, when people look at the code, you will hear comments like 'who wrote this garbage??'. In reality, the system was generally built to the best knowledge / requirements that were available at the time.

(I'm sure many people here have thought 'who wrote this crap' and then viewed the author to find out it was something they wrote many years ago, but have just gotten much better over time)

Re: Smart people don't think others are stupid

#57

Post by kappaknight »

Maybe politically correct people don't think others are stupid, but smart or not, there are definitely some morons out there.

I for one, do not need to be PC to be smart. I don't claim to know everything, but that doesn't mean there aren't people who know less who also decided a long time ago to stop learning/embracing new ideas.

Re: Smart people don't think others are stupid

#58

Post by yukyukyuk »

One thing you learn in the real world (outside of school I mean) is that there are some really stupid people out there. And I mean really incompetent people. You find them in strange places, places you wouldn't expect. There are very very few such people, and when you run into them, you know they are stupid because EVERYONE thinks they are stupid, and they cause problems for other people in the organization. If you're tuned in, you can recognize them pretty quickly. Interacting with them is worthwhile as a psychological exercise. These are the people who really don't think things through.

There are also moderately competent but not highly competent people, people who are pretty good at one thing, and when they are challenged, they almost make the cut...but not quite. These people are not stupid, but aren't the best of the best either. Sometimes the situation demands the best of the best, but very rarely (exception: never ever hire anyone but the best of the best for a start-up. If you're doing otherwise, you aren't a start-up, you're a company that is pretending to be a start-up). People generally say nice things about these sorts, and nobody holds it against them when they fail to make the highest cut.

Actually stupid people, on the other hand, just generally make a mess of a situation or do zero to negative work. You want to watch out for those types.

Re: Smart people don't think others are stupid

#59

Post by its_so_on »

You know, I've been teaching my dog a few tricks, and when I do I always think about how smart EVERYONE IS. Man, humans are so smart. If this were a human - really, practically any human that isn't currently comatose, even a baby, I would be done by now.

Smart means smart compared to something. Everyone is very smart - compared to a dog. But when you use the word smart about people, it means smarter than other people. Does that make other people stupid? In actuality, it has to.

When you say "smart people don't think others are stupid" either you are really saying "smart people never know they're smart. They think everone is just as smart as them". (This is a possibility.) Or, you are saying, "Smart people never acknowledge the fact that they're smart. Even thought they know others are not as smart, they never mention this fact."

This second possibility is probably closer to the truth. When I'm trying to get my dog to realize it can step over its own leash when it's tangled in it, it doesn't help me to think about how much smarter I am and how I never get tangled in anything.

I think smart people know very well that they're smart. Sometimes they just have better things to worry about than pointing this out. (Sometimes they don't. Linus Torvalds was quoted here calling someone a moron a few days ago. Obviusly, he's still a smart guy.)

Re: Smart people don't think others are stupid

#60

Post by Eliezer »

Sometimes people appear to me unskilled, sometimes they appear unknowledgeable, sometimes they're thinking in twisted ways that they picked up from their environment, sometimes they're falling prey to cognitive biases, sometimes they're making one of a hundred other mistakes I happen to recognize.

And sometimes, so far as I can tell, they're stupid. Sorry.

Original article's error: The fact that a conclusion sounds nice does not save it from being patently false.

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