GM Says Facebook Ads Don't Work, Pulls $10 Million Account • Hacker News Board

Re: GM Says Facebook Ads Don't Work, Pulls $10 Million Account

#81

Post by snambi » Tue, May 15, 2012, 10:07 PM UTC

ppod wrote: post #77

snambi wrote: post #43

Its obvious that Facebook ads don't work. How often you see a relevant Ad in Facebook? Almost never. So, advertisers show interesting images, but when you click on that image, it is some non-sense website. Facebook has some private information about the user, other than that FB has no clue what is my mood or what I am looking for. Its no wonder GM pulled out of Facebook.

This is really not my experience. My facebook ads are so relevant that they almost seem like a useful service at times. It knows a few of the things I'm interested in thanks to who I'm friends with or pages i've liked or whatever - so I see ads for RC planes, chess software, local restaurants... the ads seem both more relevant and less spammy than my google ads.

This is interesting. I only "liked" friend posts or pictures. May if I "like" more direct things like restaurants, brands, facebook may be able to provide me a better "ad" experience. But, its good to know that it works for some people.

Re: GM Says Facebook Ads Don't Work, Pulls $10 Million Account

#82

Post by wvenable » Tue, May 15, 2012, 10:07 PM UTC

mmaunder wrote: post #73

Facebook's root problem is intent. Users who are googling something and seeing AdWords ads are looking for something and often the thing they're looking for shows up as an ad so they - suprise! - click the ad and often become a conversion once on the site. With Facebook there is zero helpful intent. The only intent when you're on Facebook is to use Facebook. And if you do click an ad, you're less likely to become a c…

When watching TV the intent is to watch TV, not purchase soap, a car, or a soft drink. It might be that Facebook's ads are simply the wrong type/style for the kind of interaction people use it for. It does seem like Facebook ads feel like Google search ads.

Re: GM Says Facebook Ads Don't Work, Pulls $10 Million Account

#83

Post by natrius » Tue, May 15, 2012, 10:09 PM UTC

mmaunder wrote: post #73

Facebook's root problem is intent. Users who are googling something and seeing AdWords ads are looking for something and often the thing they're looking for shows up as an ad so they - suprise! - click the ad and often become a conversion once on the site. With Facebook there is zero helpful intent. The only intent when you're on Facebook is to use Facebook. And if you do click an ad, you're less likely to become a c…

For brand advertisers like GM, intent is supposed to matter less. The lack of intent was always a known factor, but I personally expected big brands to be comfortable with Facebook's lower click through rates. The fact that they're not is a huge red flag.

Re: GM Says Facebook Ads Don't Work, Pulls $10 Million Account

#84

Post by franciscoapinto » Tue, May 15, 2012, 10:10 PM UTC

wvenable wrote: post #82

mmaunder wrote: post #73

Facebook's root problem is intent. Users who are googling something and seeing AdWords ads are looking for something and often the thing they're looking for shows up as an ad so they - suprise! - click the ad and often become a conversion once on the site. With Facebook there is zero helpful intent. The only intent when you're on Facebook is to use Facebook. And if you do click an ad, you're less likely to become a c…

When watching TV the intent is to watch TV, not purchase soap, a car, or a soft drink. It might be that Facebook's ads are simply the wrong type/style for the kind of interaction people use it for. It does seem like Facebook ads feel like Google search ads.

> When watching TV the intent is to watch TV, not purchase soap, a car, or a soft drink.

The difference being that facebook doesn't make you watch a 10 second ad between each one of Dave's party photos.

Re: GM Says Facebook Ads Don't Work, Pulls $10 Million Account

#85

Post by natrius » Tue, May 15, 2012, 10:11 PM UTC

snambi wrote: post #43

Its obvious that Facebook ads don't work. How often you see a relevant Ad in Facebook? Almost never. So, advertisers show interesting images, but when you click on that image, it is some non-sense website. Facebook has some private information about the user, other than that FB has no clue what is my mood or what I am looking for. Its no wonder GM pulled out of Facebook.

Most of my ads are software companies like Asana advertising jobs. Seems well-targeted to me.

Re: GM Says Facebook Ads Don't Work, Pulls $10 Million Account

#86

Post by devs1010 » Tue, May 15, 2012, 10:12 PM UTC

The thing I don't understand is how can they say facebook ads don't work and even be sure of this, given that, as others have pointed out, they aren't going for a "conversion" as the purpose of the ads is branding, so that people think of their brand and eventually may buy a car made by them. They do other forms of advertising for branding, including TV ads, radio, billboards, etc so I don't know how its possible to pinpoint one channel of advertising (facebook) and say its not helping them with branding.

My guess is that they have an expectation of having more user feedback and involvement from this form of branding (people clicking the ad, filling out some bullshit form so they can bombard them with marketing material, etc), however the nature of the product may preclude itself from this sort of consumer behavior because people don't buy cars very often they may not feel compelled to engage with the brand, however seeing the ads on facebook could potentially have the same "branding" effectiveness as TV ads yet they really have no way of measuring this.

Re: GM Says Facebook Ads Don't Work, Pulls $10 Million Account

#87

Post by calbear81 » Tue, May 15, 2012, 10:12 PM UTC

There is no such thing as a surefire ad so saying Facebook ads don't work as a broad statement is misleading. Facebook ads don't work for GM the way they thought it would to accomplish their goals but they certainly work for many other companies. The problem GM has as well as most marketers is that they are comparing it to their traditional marketing channels and using those metrics to judge Facebook ads.

You also shouldn't use the number of followers as the addressable audience for the brand, the whole point of social is that messages are amplified through the network effect out towards a much larger reach of users. One user who likes one of your posts or comments on it may mean hundreds of friends seeing it show up in their subsequent feeds like "YCombinator reader just liked GM's Blah Blah".

Everyone's right below that if you're using it as a direct marketing channel, you'll most likely see failure because people want to stay on Facebook. Think of it as a way to stay engaged with your audience and as a one time investment for the ability to message to them again and again in the future. Facebook ads also work much better when you tie them to your Facebook presence vs. trying to send someone off Facebook to your site. GM should have thought of more creative ways to leverage the Facebook app platform to promote on-Facebook activities that drive brand value and help promote their new cars/trucks. For example, how about a contest on Facebook using an interactive car designer to design a GM that also allows you to upload custom patterns for the paint job. If it's two things people like on Facebook it's self-expression and contests.

Re: GM Says Facebook Ads Don't Work, Pulls $10 Million Account

#88

Post by malandrew » Tue, May 15, 2012, 10:16 PM UTC

mmaunder wrote: post #73

Facebook's root problem is intent. Users who are googling something and seeing AdWords ads are looking for something and often the thing they're looking for shows up as an ad so they - suprise! - click the ad and often become a conversion once on the site. With Facebook there is zero helpful intent. The only intent when you're on Facebook is to use Facebook. And if you do click an ad, you're less likely to become a c…

Intent is huge. I've never been one to click on Google Ads except in real rare instances. Only once I observed my mom using Google did I realize the full value of intent and google ads while searching.

She wanted to watch an episode of The Good Wife that she had missed so she searched in the Safari omnibar for "watch The Good Wife" and the first div under the search bar is an ad to some site that was not CBS that had the Good Wife available to watch via streaming video. To you and I, it's obvious that this "first result" is ad and we would skip over it to the first result. But to my mom, she thinks it's a search result and clicks on it. When she arrives on the site she thinks she's on the CBS site because they naively assumes like many consumers that the site showing the content would be CBS. She doesn't even think twice about the identity. When you are used to TV, you blindly trust that the site/channel showing the content is the correct one.

The only reason I discovered this was because she asked me to pull up The Good Wife to watch on CBS. I, being a savvier internet user, just navigated straight to cbs.com to search there. I got to their Good Wife site and lo and behold, there is no streaming video available on CBS, only teasers and behind the scenes content. I told my mom that "No, CBS doesn't have it on their site" and she was like "Yeah they do. I watch it all the time". I then asked her to show me exactly how she found it on CBS and that was when she showed me that she in fact was clicking on the ad in Google Search between the search box and the search results thinking it was in fact the first result. That's the power of intent and Facebook doesn't have that.

Re: GM Says Facebook Ads Don't Work, Pulls $10 Million Account

#89

Post by ericax » Tue, May 15, 2012, 10:16 PM UTC

mmaunder wrote: post #73

Facebook's root problem is intent. Users who are googling something and seeing AdWords ads are looking for something and often the thing they're looking for shows up as an ad so they - suprise! - click the ad and often become a conversion once on the site. With Facebook there is zero helpful intent. The only intent when you're on Facebook is to use Facebook. And if you do click an ad, you're less likely to become a c…

So true. Facebook ads and Google Ads are essentially different.

Re: GM Says Facebook Ads Don't Work, Pulls $10 Million Account

#90

Post by malandrew » Tue, May 15, 2012, 10:17 PM UTC

natrius wrote: post #83

mmaunder wrote: post #73

Facebook's root problem is intent. Users who are googling something and seeing AdWords ads are looking for something and often the thing they're looking for shows up as an ad so they - suprise! - click the ad and often become a conversion once on the site. With Facebook there is zero helpful intent. The only intent when you're on Facebook is to use Facebook. And if you do click an ad, you're less likely to become a c…

For brand advertisers like GM, intent is supposed to matter less. The lack of intent was always a known factor, but I personally expected big brands to be comfortable with Facebook's lower click through rates. The fact that they're not is a huge red flag.

True, but my impression is that most Facebook ads feel like performance ads and not display ads. I don't recall seeing GM ads on Facebook, but I would bet that they look and feel like performance ads and not display ads.