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Java 22 Released

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Re: Java 22 Released

#51

Post by int_19h »

jimbokun wrote: post #33

Maybe my favorite feature in this release: https://openjdk.org/jeps/463 Finally solves the inscrutable Hello World program! Yes, it's just ergonomics for early beginners. But could be the difference in whether or not someone new to programming sticks with Java or not.

They almost caught up with C#, which ditched requisite class declarations years ago. Although C# went one step further and allowed top-level code outside of methods, so that hello world is now:

   Console.WriteLine("Hello, world!")

Re: Java 22 Released

#52

Post by HackerThemAll »

jimbokun wrote: post #33

Maybe my favorite feature in this release: https://openjdk.org/jeps/463 Finally solves the inscrutable Hello World program! Yes, it's just ergonomics for early beginners. But could be the difference in whether or not someone new to programming sticks with Java or not.

C#'s got even better version of this feature since Nov 2021. Hello world is just a true one-liner.

https://learn.microsoft.com/en-us/dotnet/csharp/fundamentals...

Re: Java 22 Released

#53

Post by BroomOfSYS »

preommr wrote: post #46

It's kind of startling to see how many places still use Java 8, estimated at ~1/3 of projects according to a survey i just googled. And something like half that still use java 11.

Unbelievable! It is a strong signal that people don’t care and technical leadership is bad. Always the nonsense excuses of having to work on a “legacy” codebase for more than ten years with a team of 3 developers and 4 analysts.

Re: Java 22 Released

#54

Post by TillE »

int_19h wrote: post #51
jimbokun wrote: post #33

Maybe my favorite feature in this release: https://openjdk.org/jeps/463 Finally solves the inscrutable Hello World program! Yes, it's just ergonomics for early beginners. But could be the difference in whether or not someone new to programming sticks with Java or not.

They almost caught up with C#, which ditched requisite class declarations years ago. Although C# went one step further and allowed top-level code outside of methods, so that hello world is now: Console.WriteLine("Hello, world!")

It has been a few years, but top-level statements in C# are still a fairly recent thing (C# 9 in 2020).

Re: Java 22 Released

#55

Post by int_19h »

soulbadguy wrote: post #11
oaiey wrote: post #9

Foreign Function Interface is one of the key advantages what C# had over Java (e.g. against huge APIs like Android or macOS). I am really curious how this JEP turns out.

The FFI is also an artifact of CLR type system and the ability of have proper stack value based types.

Not just value types, but also:

1. Pointers to the same (and not just references to objects).

2. Unions (via explicit-layout structs)

3. Function pointers.

4. C-style varargs.

To be fair, not all of these have been exposed in C# historically even though CLR had them all along. Most notably, unmanaged function pointers took over 20 years. And since most people look at CLR through the prism of C#, they aren't necessarily aware of these features.

Still, one way or the other, we're at the point where pretty much any C program can be transpiled to C# in a one-to-one mapping of almost every construct (setjmp/longjmp has to be emulated with exceptions), and a very similar performance profile of the resulting code.

Re: Java 22 Released

#56

Post by MBCook »

preommr wrote: post #46

It's kind of startling to see how many places still use Java 8, estimated at ~1/3 of projects according to a survey i just googled. And something like half that still use java 11.

8 reached EOL in the last year or two. I think 11 is still under LTS.

Part of the problem is the changes made between 8 and 17 could be incredibly disruptive depending on your libraries.

If they had stuck to not using sun.* stuff you were pretty safe, but a few very popular things did.

Then somewhere in there a lot of the common server stuff moved from javax.* over to jakarta.*.

Both were needed and very good, but could turn into dependency nightmares. So depending on your app/stack it wasn’t an easy transition.

17 is fantastic though, especially coming from 8. I’m excited about what’s already in 21 (latest LTS) and coming in the next LTS after that.

Re: Java 22 Released

#57

Post by aidos »

bheadmaster wrote: post #48
jimbokun wrote: post #33

Maybe my favorite feature in this release: https://openjdk.org/jeps/463 Finally solves the inscrutable Hello World program! Yes, it's just ergonomics for early beginners. But could be the difference in whether or not someone new to programming sticks with Java or not.

Good that they got rid of the class/public static void/string[] Args boilerplate, but if they just went one step forward and declared implicit main function as top-level scope of a file, we could've got to a Python level of tersity. Just imagine! System.out.println("Hello world!");

To be that guy, not quite a python level of tersity!

Re: Java 22 Released

#58

Post by sireat »

jimbokun wrote: post #33

Maybe my favorite feature in this release: https://openjdk.org/jeps/463 Finally solves the inscrutable Hello World program! Yes, it's just ergonomics for early beginners. But could be the difference in whether or not someone new to programming sticks with Java or not.

Actually a nice feature.

This solves the public static void main string args issue.

Still if I need JVM then Scala or Kotlin are still preferable over Java.

Obligatory Java for the Haters in 100 Seconds: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=m4-HM_sCvtQ

Re: Java 22 Released

#59

Post by ulrikrasmussen »

AtlasBarfed wrote: post #44
jimbokun wrote: post #33

Maybe my favorite feature in this release: https://openjdk.org/jeps/463 Finally solves the inscrutable Hello World program! Yes, it's just ergonomics for early beginners. But could be the difference in whether or not someone new to programming sticks with Java or not.

Java continues to evolve to a bad Groovy.

How so? I don't think there are many good things to say about Groovy, but I generally agree with most new features introduced to Java. What do you think Groovy does better?

Re: Java 22 Released

#60

Post by merb »

soulbadguy wrote: post #11
oaiey wrote: post #9

Foreign Function Interface is one of the key advantages what C# had over Java (e.g. against huge APIs like Android or macOS). I am really curious how this JEP turns out.

The FFI is also an artifact of CLR type system and the ability of have proper stack value based types.

Sadly records are not value types, maybe Java will do this better, but I doubt it. Valhalla is probably years away.
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