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Car is spying on you, leading to higher insurance rates

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Re: Car is spying on you, leading to higher insurance rates

#51

Post by mint2 »

dandy23 wrote: post #45
nkurz wrote: post #42

This seems reasonable to me: if you do things that statistically correlate to being more likely to cause an accident, why shouldn't the insurance company charge you more? And since it's a relatively small group of drivers who cause the most accidents, if we could identify them the majority would see their rates drop. It's an interesting topic, and it would be nice to see more details on the accuracy of the algorithm,…

Apply it to healthcare and rethink. Not saying you are completely wrong, but I think there are other measures to stop bad driving. The whole point of insurance is also the even out the tops and bottoms. If everyone paid their fair share cost for the insurance there would be no point with insurance. You could as well pay the damage yourself when it comes.

It’s not like health.

Driving by and large is wholly controllable and should be rated on wholly controllable variables.

Not BS stuff like are you married? no? then higher rates for you.

Re: Car is spying on you, leading to higher insurance rates

#52

Post by liampulles »

I think its a good thing in principle to align driving behavior with insurance policies.

The issue for me is that this agreement has been made between the car company and the insurance company instead of me and the insurance company. And I'm disheartened to think that the average person is unlikely to care about this kind of B2B data agreement.

Until one day, they go to apply for a mortgage and discover that their credit score has evolved into a complete picture of every aspect of their lives.

Re: Car is spying on you, leading to higher insurance rates

#53

Post by mns »

nkurz wrote: post #42

This seems reasonable to me: if you do things that statistically correlate to being more likely to cause an accident, why shouldn't the insurance company charge you more? And since it's a relatively small group of drivers who cause the most accidents, if we could identify them the majority would see their rates drop. It's an interesting topic, and it would be nice to see more details on the accuracy of the algorithm,…

Just wait until you are in an edge case scenario that was never considered by the algorithm and the people developing it, or there is a bug and you are marked as a bad driver forever with no option to challenge the rating, because for normal people in insurance, the algorithm/AI can never be wrong.

Re: Car is spying on you, leading to higher insurance rates

#54

Post by cushpush »

liampulles wrote: post #52

I think its a good thing in principle to align driving behavior with insurance policies. The issue for me is that this agreement has been made between the car company and the insurance company instead of me and the insurance company. And I'm disheartened to think that the average person is unlikely to care about this kind of B2B data agreement. Until one day, they go to apply for a mortgage and discover that their cr…

>a good thing in principle to align driving behavior with insurance policies.

explain how it is not a roulette of penalties until you reach the upper echelons of wealth

Re: Car is spying on you, leading to higher insurance rates

#55

Post by delfinom »

hombre_fatal wrote: post #15

Hot take: rapid acceleration and braking are symptoms of bad driving, and bad driving should come with barriers to being on the road with us and landing in our insurance pools. Driving information is fine to collect on public roads, and it should be ubiquitous rather than something collected in secret. Meanwhile in Texas, red light cameras can’t even be used to give tickets anymore.

In my NY suburbs, there are intersections you have to gun it because the local nimbys refuse traffic light installs.

(Long story short, there's one university here that has to use their state troopers to assert authority and shut local roads every hour for the commuter class change rush because the local morons refuse traffic signal changes, same university also had to use eminent domain to build sidewalks, lololololol)

O man, you should see our parkways, you only have 20 feet of ramp to reach highway speeds or you will die. Same for exiting and you need to brake from highway speeds.

Just an example where hard acceleration != bad driving

Re: Car is spying on you, leading to higher insurance rates

#58

Post by sneak »

bdangubic wrote: post #5
sneak wrote: post #3

Earlier quoted context omitted.

my laptop. my camera. my non-gsm vehicle. my garage door opener. my television. my coffee machine. my fridge. my e-reader. my paper library. my turntable. my furniture. my firearms. my hand tools. my bicycle. my luggage. my stove. most of my tools aren’t spying on me. this sort of “privacy is impossible, we shouldn’t fight privacy invasions” is defeatist and toxic imho.

oh boy… your laptop is spying on you 24/7 unless it is in the basement disconnected from the internet. your TV is spying on you unless it is black&white :) you e-reader is spying on you. your non-gsm vehicle may not be spying on you directly but thosands or license plate readers all over the place are…

my e-reader is not connected to a network. neither is my television.

my laptop’s traffic is regularly monitored both on and off device, and i also have root on it. it’s not spying on me- i know because one actually has to check these sorts of things.

Re: Car is spying on you, leading to higher insurance rates

#59

Post by [deleted] »

hnlmorg wrote: post #9
sneak wrote: post #3

Earlier quoted context omitted.

my laptop. my camera. my non-gsm vehicle. my garage door opener. my television. my coffee machine. my fridge. my e-reader. my paper library. my turntable. my furniture. my firearms. my hand tools. my bicycle. my luggage. my stove. most of my tools aren’t spying on me. this sort of “privacy is impossible, we shouldn’t fight privacy invasions” is defeatist and toxic imho.

> my laptop. That almost certainly is > my camera Are you sure your images aren't being tagged with location data? That's a pretty common feature these days > my non-gsm vehicle Most vehicles still record diagnostic data. Even if they don't upload it > my television How old is your TV? Any TV made in the last 5 years will be. 10+ years will still have diagnostic logs but might not upload them automatically. Also sate…

[deleted]

Re: Car is spying on you, leading to higher insurance rates

#60

Post by falcolas »

nickjj wrote: post #43
tyingq wrote: post #33

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I assume they just don't care about exceptions, and just correlate past data to actual claims to adjust their actuarial tables. But to your point, maybe that also penalizes non-aggressive things that result in accidents.

> I assume they just don't care about exceptions, and just correlate past data to actual claims to adjust their actuarial tables Yep, IMO that's a problem in general. So much is based on case studies in aggregate instead of individuals. The same thing happens with medicine (at least in the US). Just because 200 people in 1 study demonstrated that X year old Y gender people who live in Z have 7.8917% more likelihood t…

> So much is based on case studies in aggregate instead of individuals.

Isn't this a good thing? Insurance is about spreading individual risk across a group. Hyper targeting the premiums of individuals according to their individual risk is the exact opposite of spreading risk.

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