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House passes bill to force TikTok sale from Chinese owner or ban the app

nytimes.com

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Re: House passes bill to force TikTok sale from Chinese owner or ban the app

#991

Post by engineer_22 »

amou234 wrote: post #741
throwaway199956 wrote: post #613

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Doesn't first ammendment protect even that. Propaganda of other countries are legal under first ammendment. Why should we be a nanny state that should dictate which apps one can or cannot use on one's device. Also even at the hight of cold war, Soviet Life magazine was published and disseminated widely in the US.

What most of the posters in this thread don't realize is that US is effectively at war with China. China is working in front of the scenes to be the major funder of Russia's war [1] against Europe, which is US's ally amongst the coalition of democratic countries. China is working behind the scenes to stop the supply of artillery shells to Ukraine. [2]. and it is increasingly and more visibly supplying Russia with mil…

US is not at war with China. We are in a period of escalating tension, but have broad and far reaching economic, political, and social ties. Despite our disagreements, we have in the past and continue to cooperate on mutually beneficial terms.

That said, the CCP is not hoping for the United States to suddenly become politically stabilized. They are not hoping for the US populace to embrace the current social and economic order which stands at odds to Chinese goals. The CCP is an extremely disciplined predator organization with a long-term outlook, and should be dealt with appropriately.

Re: House passes bill to force TikTok sale from Chinese owner or ban the app

#992

Post by minosdz »

zachmu wrote: post #530
jrockway wrote: post #486

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I don't think we should "lowest common denominator" to oppressive regimes. Our Constitution says "Congress shall make no law respecting an establishment of religion, or prohibiting the free exercise thereof; or abridging the freedom of speech, or of the press; or the right of the people peaceably to assemble, and to petition the Government for a redress of grievances." TikTok, at the end of the day, is just a kind of…

Tiktok isn't "some website", it is partially owned and controlled by the CCP, which influences what content gets shown to Americans. A majority of zoomers get most of their news and information primarily from this platform, which again is under the influence of a hostile foreign government. (TikTok also spies on US citizens for the CCP, but let's keep this restricted to the free speech argument about the ban). We act…

If you really care about who spies on who, check with AIPAC and similar groups that said that openly, and no one gave a dime.

TikTok is less censored compared to FB, Instagram, X.com etc.. Look how many Israel supporter funded this action (banning/buying Tiktok) Always look for the one with most interest in having Tiktok controlled, you will know who are are the lobbyistes behind. (Follow the money)

Re: House passes bill to force TikTok sale from Chinese owner or ban the app

#993

Post by coupdejarnac »

rchaud wrote: post #449
coupdejarnac wrote: post #412

I'm seeing a lot of "censorship is bad" propaganda coming from the shills. This resonates with liberal minded people who are against censorship. Now, that's not to say that most people here are shills or wrong for being against censorship. However they are unwittingly being coopted just as anti-racists were when China deflected any responsibility for a lab leak.

The way the US had dealt with issues like this is in the courts of law through an evidentiary process, not by political decree, which will get slammed down in the courts anyway. Show that TikTok causes active harm compared to FB/Twitter, put that on the public record, and clear the obstacles for a bill to ban.

You're not wrong, but it's also true that China is exploiting our liberal, rule of law way of doing things in the USA.

As for a record of doing harm, mobile apps like douyin (China tiktok) have enabled a total police state in China. Say the wrong thing in a private conversation in an app, and the police will invite you to have tea.

Try being critical of China on tiktok and see how long it takes before you get banned. This isn't a hypothetical, it has already happened.

Re: House passes bill to force TikTok sale from Chinese owner or ban the app

#994

Post by harkinian »

jiggawatts wrote: post #987
harkinian wrote: post #880

Earlier quoted context omitted.

We aren't at war with China either.

Yeah well, that's just a matter of time in the exact same way that Russia's invasion of Ukraine was predicted over a decade ahead, often by US senators. E.g.: https://www.theguardian.com/world/2023/may/05/we-knew-putin-... https://www.mccaininstitute.org/resources/in-the-news/icymi-... Etc...

I'll bet that for every country in the world, a senator has predicted a war against them. And we still aren't at war with Russia, but you could call them an enemy for sure.

Re: House passes bill to force TikTok sale from Chinese owner or ban the app

#995

Post by angryasian »

dang wrote: post #971
angryasian wrote: post #964

Earlier quoted context omitted.

explain to me how this isn't all xenophobic ? If any of this was real or legit all users would be clamoring for data privacy laws, not a forced sale of some fake boogey man bs. If you're a mod then please why are you allowing for this. Half this xenophobic speach and anti chinese rhetoric is worse than calling it out.

(I'm a mod, yes.) I'm not defending anyone else's bad comments. I'm saying we need you to follow the rules, regardless of how bad other comments are or you feel they are. The same goes for everyone. I've put in countless hours, over the years, trying to do just what you're demanding here. That's why I gave you that last link to look at. We've learned the hard way that there are limits to what moderators can do about…

i appreciate your response.

Re: House passes bill to force TikTok sale from Chinese owner or ban the app

#996

Post by [deleted] »

jiggawatts wrote: post #986
takerjop wrote: post #981

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Because Chinese control American supplies of widgets. You can check out Tesla, Apple, Walmart where they get their goodies from. Or how about Ametican universities. If things are as simple as a tic for tac, the trade inbalance wouldnt be in 200B+ in China favor.

Maybe it would be more balanced if China allowed US software companies into their country the same way the rest of the world does. (Except Russia, Myanmar, North Korea, and a handful of other similar places.)

[deleted]

Re: House passes bill to force TikTok sale from Chinese owner or ban the app

#997

Post by parthianshotgun »

hayst4ck wrote: post #818
zachmu wrote: post #633

Earlier quoted context omitted.

A US citizen distributing foreign media themselves is quite different than what is effectively a directly controlled broadcast owned by a foreign government.

Is it? When you're saying that, I think you're imagining your neighbor, not your oligarch. When one country tries to cause chaos in another, they use a two pronged approach. (1) they offer a country's aristocracy the ability to enrich themselves at the cost of their people. This could be things like cheap labor, gas pipelines, or being the guarantor of loans. (2) They tell a countries peasantry that the worlds proble…

Rationally...I don't find that that is implied. China is doing that rationally from a completely self interested, in the animal sense, way. The point of freedom is freedom, it's an end unto itself, if people are fooled or liable to control given such freedom, let them be. Control hardly ever "works" (in the ultimate sense), maybe in children, but we're not talking about children. Children also grow old.

Re: House passes bill to force TikTok sale from Chinese owner or ban the app

#998

Post by parthianshotgun »

agency wrote: post #652
flakeoil wrote: post #645

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Why should we be a nanny state that should dictate which bomber planes can or cannot enter our country?

Great point - flying a bomber plane over a country is protected speech.

Please indicate your sarcasm for I fear parent might take you literally

Re: House passes bill to force TikTok sale from Chinese owner or ban the app

#999

Post by parthianshotgun »

kelseyfrog wrote: post #975
badrequest wrote: post #693

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Yeah, we should only tolerate domestic propaganda outlets.

Like beer, consumers of propaganda should have a choice in foreign or domestic.

This made me giggle
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