Lyft, Uber to leave Minneapolis after city council forces higher driver pay
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Re: Lyft, Uber to leave Minneapolis after city council forces higher driver pay
#2Key part of the article: though this measure was passed by the council, the mayor promised to veto it.
Re: Lyft, Uber to leave Minneapolis after city council forces higher driver pay
#3What is the point of laws like this? They are way too specific. Instead the Minneapolis City Council should come out with legislation prohibiting the re-definition of what a contractor is. Uber and Lyft claim that their drivers are contractors, but then also don't allow their drivers to set rates themselves. It's an absolute tragedy that governments just let companies get away with "disruption" when its really just flaunting established laws and regulations.
The IRS is clear on what the definition[0] of an independent contractor is. Uber and Lyft drivers do not meet the definition because of the constraints imposed upon them by said companies.
[0]: https://www.irs.gov/businesses/small-businesses-self-employe...
Re: Lyft, Uber to leave Minneapolis after city council forces higher driver pay
#4Key part of the article: though this measure was passed by the council, the mayor promised to veto it.
The veto was overridden by the council.
Re: Lyft, Uber to leave Minneapolis after city council forces higher driver pay
#5What is the point of laws like this? They are way too specific. Instead the Minneapolis City Council should come out with legislation prohibiting the re-definition of what a contractor is. Uber and Lyft claim that their drivers are contractors, but then also don't allow their drivers to set rates themselves. It's an absolute tragedy that governments just let companies get away with "disruption" when its really just f…
It's not actually that clear cut. There are at least a dozen factors that speak to the differences between an employee and a contractor, and setting your own rates or prices is only one of them. In general, you don't need to have all of these different factors before you are deemed a contractor, you only need several of them. And one of those factors is whether you bring significant equipment of your own to do the job, or if you use your employer’s equipment. Ride–share drivers drive their own personal car, which is a big step towards being a contractor. They also choose which jobs to accept, and what hours to work.
Compare that with a Chef. The Chef at a restaurant decides on the menu, buys (or at least orders) the food, and cooks it to their own specifications. All of pushes them towards contractor. But they do all of that in their employer’s kitchen, using equipment provided by the employer. Therefore the IRS generally decides that chefs are employees.
Re: Lyft, Uber to leave Minneapolis after city council forces higher driver pay
#6What is the point of laws like this? They are way too specific. Instead the Minneapolis City Council should come out with legislation prohibiting the re-definition of what a contractor is. Uber and Lyft claim that their drivers are contractors, but then also don't allow their drivers to set rates themselves. It's an absolute tragedy that governments just let companies get away with "disruption" when its really just f…
>Uber and Lyft claim that their drivers are contractors, but then also don't allow their drivers to set rates themselves.
Your own linked document says nothing about contractors being required to set their own rate. Other IRS documents[1] also does not mention being able to set your own rate as a factor.
[1] https://www.irs.gov/businesses/small-businesses-self-employe...
>The IRS is clear on what the definition[0] of an independent contractor is. Uber and Lyft drivers do not meet the definition because of the constraints imposed upon them by said companies.
The linked document doesn't say much aside from "You are not an independent contractor if you perform services that can be controlled by an employer", which isn't exactly "clear".
Re: Lyft, Uber to leave Minneapolis after city council forces higher driver pay
#7What is the point of laws like this? They are way too specific. Instead the Minneapolis City Council should come out with legislation prohibiting the re-definition of what a contractor is. Uber and Lyft claim that their drivers are contractors, but then also don't allow their drivers to set rates themselves. It's an absolute tragedy that governments just let companies get away with "disruption" when its really just f…
It's not actually that clear cut. There are at least a dozen factors that speak to the differences between an employee and a contractor, and setting your own rates or prices is only one of them. In general, you don't need to have all of these different factors before you are deemed a contractor, you only need several of them. And one of those factors is whether you bring significant equipment of your own to do the jo…
Most chefs don't get to set their own pay rates, nor hours. If a restaurant gave a chef a contract of "come in and help our kitchen team whenever you like, but up to you how often you do" would using the employer's equipment matter?
The things you said (choosing what food to buy etc) just means their boss (ie maybe the owner of the place) has made choosing food part of their job requirement. I can't imagine how being given more responsibility like that is in any way related to contractor or not, as long as the chef's job requires them to provide food to paying customers.
Re: Lyft, Uber to leave Minneapolis after city council forces higher driver pay
#8What is the point of laws like this? They are way too specific. Instead the Minneapolis City Council should come out with legislation prohibiting the re-definition of what a contractor is. Uber and Lyft claim that their drivers are contractors, but then also don't allow their drivers to set rates themselves. It's an absolute tragedy that governments just let companies get away with "disruption" when its really just f…
You set your own hours or even if you work at all. Don’t feel like working? You just don’t. Don’t have to tell anyone or get permission and no one gets mad.
I have multiple friends who drive for Uber/Lyft, and it’s their second side gig they do when they have a couple extra hours and want some extra money.
Even if it’s not perfectly an independent contractor, from a practical standpoint it sure doesn’t smell like traditional employment at all. Imagining the Venn Diagram of features, it seems a lot closer to contactor.
Re: Lyft, Uber to leave Minneapolis after city council forces higher driver pay
#9Earlier quoted context omitted.
It's not actually that clear cut. There are at least a dozen factors that speak to the differences between an employee and a contractor, and setting your own rates or prices is only one of them. In general, you don't need to have all of these different factors before you are deemed a contractor, you only need several of them. And one of those factors is whether you bring significant equipment of your own to do the jo…
Most chefs don't get to set their own pay rates, nor hours. If a restaurant gave a chef a contract of "come in and help our kitchen team whenever you like, but up to you how often you do" would using the employer's equipment matter? The things you said (choosing what food to buy etc) just means their boss (ie maybe the owner of the place) has made choosing food part of their job requirement. I can't imagine how being…
One of the things that the IRS looks at is who makes the decisions. If your boss decides what you work on, how you do the work, when you do the work, and where you do the work, then you are probably an employee (but there are other factors to consider as well). However, the more of those that you choose for yourself then the more likely it is that you are actually a contractor. So there are some factors in favor of the chef being a contractor. However, you are right; it is very rare for a chef to actually be a contractor. That’s because these factors are usually outweighed by others. In particular, the chef works in a kitchen owned by their employer, and they can really only be the chef of one restaurant at a time.
But this is the point of the example: both the chef and the ride–share driver make similar decisions for themselves. They both decide for themselves how to accomplish the goal given to them by their employer. But unlike the chef, the ride–share driver also provides their own car. That’s a huge financial commitment that the driver makes and brings to the arrangement. Plus, they can easily work for more than one service at a time. Sure, they can only have one passenger at a time, but they can sign in to multiple services at the same time and pick and choose between jobs offered by all of them.
So while a chef is rarely going to be a contractor, a ride–share driver probably is. They have many more factors in favor of them being a contractor than the chef has.
Re: Lyft, Uber to leave Minneapolis after city council forces higher driver pay
#10> The measure requires ride-hailing companies to pay drivers at least $1.40 per mile and $0.51 per minute for the time spent transporting a rider — or $5 per ride, whichever is greater — excluding tips.
Whether the rates are reasonable or not, the obvious move would be for Uber/Lyft to comply and pass the costs on to the riders, just like taxi companies have been doing forever. By instead pulling out entirely they are sending a message to Minneapolis and everyone else – if you try and regulate us in any way you will lose our services and your voter base will revolt, and we are willing to take the revenue hit for it.