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Vancouver’s new mega-development is big, ambitious and Indigenous

macleans.ca

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Re: Vancouver’s new mega-development is big, ambitious and Indigenous

#121
post #99
post #93

Earlier quoted context omitted.

What does acceptable use of their own land look like to you? What would meet your specific approval?

The question is could someone build a similiar structure beside or does zoning prevent this. If so parent has a valid point

It's not our land, zoning is meaningless. Who cares about a hypothetical if something "could" have been built here

Re: Vancouver’s new mega-development is big, ambitious and Indigenous

#122

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I'm not sure why that matters? If others would offer the tribe a better offer, I'm sure they would accept it.

I guess the point I was trying to make is that the public is being manipulated by the moral framing of this project. The buildings would not be normally allowed in that area, and the proponents of project are using an explicit racial justice narrative to counteract criticism of their violation of norms. I'm agnostic about whether or not the project is good idea, but I think it's generally bad to manipulate people in…

> the proponents of project are using an explicit racial justice narrative to counteract criticism of their violation of norms.

Pretty easy to do when some of the criticism indeed sounds kinda racist. Example from the article:

> In 2022, Gordon Price, a prominent Vancouver urban planner and a former city councillor, told Gitxsan reporter Angela Sterritt, “When you’re building 30, 40-storey high rises out of concrete, there’s a big gap between that and an Indigenous way of building.”

I'm sorry, but does he expect indigenous people to only build log cabins forever or something? Maybe they should also forgo cars and buses and only use horses?

Re: Vancouver’s new mega-development is big, ambitious and Indigenous

#123
post #105

I say this all as a YIMBY who is very happy to see 20k new units added to vancouver: something feels off about the plans for the Jericho lands but I can't describe it. I feel like when you have these mega developments where 10 condos go up all at once in the space of a few blocks, they end up as "bedroom neighborhoods", where people sleep but don't do anything else. There are a lot of these happening in Canada right…

It's not exactly what you're getting at, but you might enjoy Christopher Alexander's essay "A City is not a Tree". It also talks about why highly planned cities can end up not working and feeling "right" in the way that older more incrementally-grown ones can.

Re: Vancouver’s new mega-development is big, ambitious and Indigenous

#124
post #105

I say this all as a YIMBY who is very happy to see 20k new units added to vancouver: something feels off about the plans for the Jericho lands but I can't describe it. I feel like when you have these mega developments where 10 condos go up all at once in the space of a few blocks, they end up as "bedroom neighborhoods", where people sleep but don't do anything else. There are a lot of these happening in Canada right…

I disagree about master plan neighborhoods being better. It's just way too much ownership, control, and responsibility for one developer or one period of time, usually. Imo, master planned neighborhoods are an optimistic dismissal of the idea that organic evolution of a neighborhood should be allowed to happen, and a massive bet on whatever gets built being great. Often this takes place as a huge cul-de-sac suburb with one place designated for a gas station and a few shops, or as just an isolated parcel where most of the businesses end up being franchises and people drive out to visit other places rather than shopping nearby. In the prairies, these developments build over wetlands on the outskirts where land is cheapest and it's all boilerplate garbage that the developer has decided in advance it's probably everything everyone needs. A sort of "This is where the houses go, this is where the commercial is, here's the rest of the city". Everything ends up looking pretty samey and dull.

In other cases, when it happens in a city, like in Burnaby or Oakridge, it ends up displacing in some way or another way more people than is necessary, because they have a grand vision to replace 10 blocks of housing or something.

Re: Vancouver’s new mega-development is big, ambitious and Indigenous

#125
post #48

Let me see if I got this. 1. Settlers colonize indigenous lands, drive indigenous people into small parcels and reservations and try to exterminate their culture. 2. Settlers decide to start refusing to build enough housing for themselves because they don’t want to alter the “character of the neighborhood” after… uhh… very much doing that. 3. Indigenous people build housing on their remaining bits of land for settler…

The Bay Area indigenous land movement is finally starting to see some wins. Shellmound in Berkeley is a big win for the Ohlone tribe. [0] [0] https://www.berkeleyside.org/2024/03/12/berkeley-shellmound-...

Different structure though. These folk are preservationists and only decided to fight for the place once the parking lot was going to be replaced. Overall, it's not a bad play, though. 36% profit underperforms the loan over the period, but it's not nothing.

Re: Vancouver’s new mega-development is big, ambitious and Indigenous

#126
post #105

I say this all as a YIMBY who is very happy to see 20k new units added to vancouver: something feels off about the plans for the Jericho lands but I can't describe it. I feel like when you have these mega developments where 10 condos go up all at once in the space of a few blocks, they end up as "bedroom neighborhoods", where people sleep but don't do anything else. There are a lot of these happening in Canada right…

If it is discontinuous with the broader urban fabric this is definitely a risk. Look up Ørestad in Copenhagen - a massive master planned area that never gained any of the hoped for vitality you would see elsewhere in the city. A decent video: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=8OMxzXsufq8

I think the tough part is it's hard to master plan these thing sometimes. Is it better to limit restrictions and let people put coffee shops and bars where they want?

Re: Vancouver’s new mega-development is big, ambitious and Indigenous

#127
post #120

It's comforting to see first nations of canada recovering a central role in modern canadian society. However, having lived here for a year a year now, I have observed a concerning aspect of this re-integration, which is mentioned in the article: First nations aren't just propped back up and re-integrated in society, it goes further in that they are given special rights that go beyond what any other class of canadian…

> On moral grounds, I find it questionable to give some citizens special birth rights greater than others.

Kind of the point here is that it was happening the other way for a couple hundred years, so just abrogating current inequality still leaves one party as a disadvantage. The hard part is deciding when these catch-up priveleges have run their course. Since first nations metrics along the lines of economic status are still below the national average, it's clear we're not there just yet.

Re: Vancouver’s new mega-development is big, ambitious and Indigenous

#129

The native nation, Squamish Nation, used to own the entire parcel of land immediately north of the 10 acres land mentioned in this article as a reservation granted by the former-colonial government (a native village stood in Vancouver downtown but the colonial gov forced them to move across the inlet). But thru multiple forced relocations and unceded land take over, the reservation was gradually taken over. >Slowly,…

I don't know if it's fair to call a bridge a stroad

Re: Vancouver’s new mega-development is big, ambitious and Indigenous

#130
post #102
post #90

Think this is great for Vancouver which needs more housing. The zoning is broken, and far too conservative. Glad to see the Squamish addressing a need that will likely benefit all, and hopefully this encourages the city of Vancouver to do the same on their own accord.

Building more homes in Vancouver will not result in lower prices because this is not a supply problem it is the financial assetization of home equity that drives higher and higher prices. Blue collar workers turned multi-millionaires rely on the continued rise of home prices to purchase cheap credit which they use to speculate on more homes. When they couldn't find anymore locals they turned to the international mark…

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