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Vehicle brakes produce charged particles that may harm public health: study

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Re: Vehicle brakes produce charged particles that may harm public health: study

#51
post #6

We need to go back to horseback riding. It's inevitable.

And busy streets once again knee-deep in manure? Horses aren't exactly zero-emission either.

Though realistically, a lot more people walked. Not everybody could afford to feed or care for a horse.

Re: Vehicle brakes produce charged particles that may harm public health: study

#52

This will come from all ground transportation sources, right? Busses, trains, trams, subways etc. Probably the heavier the vehicle the more particles are likely to be produced?

Heavy vehicles like busses and trucks more often have drum brakes which I guess are better from a air pollution view?

Re: Vehicle brakes produce charged particles that may harm public health: study

#53

Earlier quoted context omitted.

But you rarely have to brake an EV though. I’ve had two EV’s over the last 6 years, and I have to remember to occasionally hit the brakes to keep them from rusting. One pedal driving is just money - saves power and is just much smoother over all than old school breaking. IMO.

I've never driven an EV. How do you approach stop signs and red lights other than braking? Is "engine braking" (regenerative braking?) strong enough to handle that big a fraction of slowing down in city traffic?

From what I know, there are several settings of regenerative braking you can choose. The higher levels will bring the vehicle to a stop, while the lower ones won't. So it's user-configurable to a degree.

Re: Vehicle brakes produce charged particles that may harm public health: study

#54

Earlier quoted context omitted.

But you rarely have to brake an EV though. I’ve had two EV’s over the last 6 years, and I have to remember to occasionally hit the brakes to keep them from rusting. One pedal driving is just money - saves power and is just much smoother over all than old school breaking. IMO.

I've never driven an EV. How do you approach stop signs and red lights other than braking? Is "engine braking" (regenerative braking?) strong enough to handle that big a fraction of slowing down in city traffic?

Based on my experience (electric motorbike), the regenerative breaks are super strong indeed. You can tweak their « force », but usually, the strongest level is the most comfortable - that you eventually keep all day long. It will cause you to full stop even on the steepest slopes.

Once you’re used to it, you dose your deceleration by focusing on how much you release the throttle.

And the only situations where you have to hit the breaks are the unexpected events - e.g., a car coming at the last moment and which you should give priority to.

Re: Vehicle brakes produce charged particles that may harm public health: study

#55
post #34
post #6

We need to go back to horseback riding. It's inevitable.

back when we all rode horses, falling off of them was at the top of the accidental death risk for the average person.

> for the average person.

For the average horse rider perhaps but not the average person. Most people were never on a horse.

Re: Vehicle brakes produce charged particles that may harm public health: study

#56
post #10

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Indeed, to replace a brake you must remove it first; and better brake pads there are. Oerlikon of Switzerland has brake pad technology that has near zero emissions and does not need replacing. It’s not in production due to pressure for revenue from service shops.

> Oerlikon of Switzerland has brake pad technology that has near zero emissions and does not need replacing. It’s not in production due to pressure for revenue from service shops. You're likely referring to DiscCover [1], a relatively recent development - at least Volvo Trucks has an agreement to use that technology [2]. The problem is that the car industry is notorious for long product development cycles. New invent…

From your link

> Take for example our DiscCover coating solution: authorities worldwide have introduced stringent limits for exhaust emissions — including NOX, CO2 and particulate matter. Increasingly, regulators are turning their attention to fine dust emissions from brake wear. On average, 31% of passenger- vehicle-related emissions are caused by brake wear. This results in more than 90 000 metric tons of fine dust per year in the OECD countries alone. The DiscCover solutions from Oerlikon Balzers and Oerlikon Metco significantly reduce fine dust from brake discs so that our customers are equipped to comply with stricter regulations as they improve their environmental footprint.

and elsewhere [1]

> We can help brake system manufacturers and designers prepare for stricter regulations by significantly reducing fine dust and extending disk life

Reducing fine dust is great, but (1) this seems to only be about brake discs, not brake pads, and (2) there's no support in Oerlikon marketing materials for GP's claim that this magically means brake pads don't need replacing.

> Oerlikon of Switzerland has brake pad technology that has near zero emissions and does not need replacing

This seems not unlike the stories that go around about how someone was sold a 200mpg prototype car by accident but then the car company took it back because they don't want people to have them.

[1] https://www.oerlikon.com/balzers/us/en/markets/heat-treatmen...

Re: Vehicle brakes produce charged particles that may harm public health: study

#57
post #16
post #8

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I hope we'll crack down on heavy SUVs vs normal cars before electric vs ICE.

Tires are somewhere near the top for distributing microplastics and heavier cars cause more tire wear, so yea we should get on that. I live next to a main road and we run filters in our house and have to wash the surfaces at least once a week to get off the oil and rubber dust. You can't just dust that stuff either, you have to wash it with soap. I almost regret buying this place, but where else would I have bought i…

most ppl live next to a road so i gather yours is a pretty hefty one or you overlooked other sources of polution

Re: Vehicle brakes produce charged particles that may harm public health: study

#58

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I've never driven an EV. How do you approach stop signs and red lights other than braking? Is "engine braking" (regenerative braking?) strong enough to handle that big a fraction of slowing down in city traffic?

Based on my experience (electric motorbike), the regenerative breaks are super strong indeed. You can tweak their « force », but usually, the strongest level is the most comfortable - that you eventually keep all day long. It will cause you to full stop even on the steepest slopes. Once you’re used to it, you dose your deceleration by focusing on how much you release the throttle. And the only situations where you ha…

[deleted]

Re: Vehicle brakes produce charged particles that may harm public health: study

#59

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I suspect horses come with their own health issues. Can you imagine a city parking garage for horses?

You mean a stable? They had those in ancient times in castles. A multi-story stable is funny to picture, but I don't see why not.

I do indeed mean a stable! I don't imagine the particulates coming out of stables are going to be all that great. Also, my car doesn't get sick if I park it next to somebody's beater.

Re: Vehicle brakes produce charged particles that may harm public health: study

#60

Earlier quoted context omitted.

You mean a stable? They had those in ancient times in castles. A multi-story stable is funny to picture, but I don't see why not.

I do indeed mean a stable! I don't imagine the particulates coming out of stables are going to be all that great. Also, my car doesn't get sick if I park it next to somebody's beater.

There are classes of parking garages too. I’m not parking my hypothetical dream Ferrari next to some poor person’s beat up Honda civic from the 90’s to get dinged and the windows broken. The underground parking garage at Apple must be astounding.
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