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It's OK for Apple to block Firefox, but wrong when Microsoft does it

blogs.computerworld.com

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Re: It's OK for Apple to block Firefox, but wrong when Microsoft does it

#191

Post by [deleted] »

Elepsis wrote: post #174
virmundi wrote: post #172

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The thing about adoption in start ups is that Visual Studio 2010 Pro is so expensive. If Microsoft really wants to stay relevant they have to release Pro for free. They have to compete on price with the Eclipse or VIM/command line world. Until then, they will slowly die off. (The express versions are a joke, don't even get me started).

Microsoft runs a BizSpark program that, for all intents and purposes, gives startups access to most Microsoft software for free. http://www.microsoft.com/bizspark/

[deleted]

Re: It's OK for Apple to block Firefox, but wrong when Microsoft does it

#192

Post by randomfool »

sriramk wrote: post #144
randomfool wrote: post #122

Earlier quoted context omitted.

"Strategically, it makes a lot of sense to own the browsing experience e2e" Can you expand on this? There are a couple of benefits I can think of, but no major ones. - Quality of experience: owning the browser ensures that sub-par browsers don't degrade the overall experience (such as destroy battery life and overall platform impressions). - Controlling innovation: If Microsoft feels threatened by HTML then it can li…

I don't think Microsoft will make the mistake of falling behind on the web platform again. In fact, their latest moves (both tech, organization-wise) show them throwing more weight behind IE/HTML and less behind .NET/SL/Win32 (this is from me reading the tea leaves from the outside, not any inside scoops).

I'd argue that MS is still falling behind- IE10 is just catching up but has no leapfrogging and how far out is IE11?

Even more critically, look at all of the users MS is leaving behind- no XP support for IE9, will they abandon Win8 users when there's still a massive number of them?

Unless IE ramps up their release cycle I see no way they can stay on the leading edge.

Re: It's OK for Apple to block Firefox, but wrong when Microsoft does it

#193

Post by thomasjoulin »

As much as I love iOS, I'm sad of some of the comment saying it's normal for Apple to block Chrome/Firefox for security reasons. Tablets (arguably, only the iPad, really) are the future of computing, like it or not. Having a single browser on highly connected machines is shoking.

The whole lockin is understandable, the plateform is relatively new, and proved to be successful in part because if these extreme protections.

But sooner rather than later, Apple is going to have to open some stuff. Being with something like gae keeper on iOS could allow to (very few) browser vendor to get on the App Store with full access to the sysem. Mozilla and Google build solid products with few security issues (if you factor off the security bugs from plugins)

iOS is a very modern OS, but will deeply profit from competition in the browser space. Apple too. The best tablet for apps and web browsing will win in the long run, because the web will win in the long run, but people will always prefer native apps for specific stuff.

Re: It's OK for Apple to block Firefox, but wrong when Microsoft does it

#194

Post by bzbarsky »

Drbble wrote: post #180
bzbarsky wrote: post #166

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Because that would imply support costs that are just not worth it, if nothing else? Just a guess; I'm not privy to these sorts of decisions.

It is open source free software. Anyone could send it to Cydia as iceweasel.

Indeed!

Re: It's OK for Apple to block Firefox, but wrong when Microsoft does it

#195

Post by sses »

ricardobeat wrote: post #109
wvenable wrote: post #11

A lot of people, including the author of this article, seem to think it's unfair that Mozilla is not giving equal complaint time to both platforms. That's the fundamental issue here. Maybe, all things being equal , that would be a fair complaint but all things are not equal. First of all, the limitations of iOS and app store are well known and retread at least once a month on HN since the site opened. Mozilla certain…

The reason that Apple does not allow other engines in iOS is simple: it keeps all performance and security issues restricted to a single code base. That's good for users too. Considering that browsers implement the gross of their functionality (rendering + javascript) according to standards, there is no reason to have two different platforms that do exactly the same thing. As long as the standard is not owned by any…

Why restrict that reasoning to browsers on iOS? You could apply the same reasoning to restrict OS X to only run Safari. Or only allow iTunes for playing music, since there are standards for encoding audio and organizing playlists.

The fact there are browser standards is not a reason to only have one. Competition among browsers leads to improvement in standardized areas like scripting and rendering, and browsers can offer a lot of other functionality that benefits users.

Re: It's OK for Apple to block Firefox, but wrong when Microsoft does it

#196

Post by kmontrose »

[deleted] wrote: post #191
Elepsis wrote: post #174

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Microsoft runs a BizSpark program that, for all intents and purposes, gives startups access to most Microsoft software for free. http://www.microsoft.com/bizspark/

[deleted]

You only pay for licenses over 4 OS and 2 SQL Server (or outright new ones) after graduating BizSpark. 2 SQL Servers (OS licenses are chump change by comparison) go a loooong way* too, as you're presumably scaling up rather than out.

http://www.microsoft.com/bizspark/about/Graduation.aspx

Through the grapevine I hear the "review" process (for more free licenses at graduation) is extraordinarily accommodating, though I'd guess if you're spinning up a box per customer or something insane you'd get denied.

Lots of people get this wrong, I'm surprised Microsoft hasn't carved this correction into a mountain somewhere...

*Stack Exchange is running 2 + failover ( http://blog.serverfault.com/2011/09/30/the-stack-exchange-ar... ), and was running on 1 not too terribly long ago.

Re: It's OK for Apple to block Firefox, but wrong when Microsoft does it

#197

Post by contextfree »

rbanffy wrote: post #158
ricardobeat wrote: post #131

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Indeed they could, I just said that. This lock might force MS to make IE's engine as good as WebKit. I don't see any problem as long as the standards are kept open and the engine doesn't belong to a single entity.

You got the lock-in strategy backwards. It exists to allow the incumbent not to improve their products while maximizing their profits because they don't have to compete.

The product here is Windows - the purpose of IE for Microsoft is to help Windows, not vice versa.

Re: It's OK for Apple to block Firefox, but wrong when Microsoft does it

#198

Post by Too »

virmundi wrote: post #172
estel wrote: post #141

Earlier quoted context omitted.

That sounds like a function of the people you've met tbh. Looking at job postings around these parts, the most widespread platform remains .NET. Whilst the non-existent adoption amongst startups doesn't necessarily bode well for MSFT's future, there is still a huge amount of .NET development going on worldwide.

The thing about adoption in start ups is that Visual Studio 2010 Pro is so expensive. If Microsoft really wants to stay relevant they have to release Pro for free. They have to compete on price with the Eclipse or VIM/command line world. Until then, they will slowly die off. (The express versions are a joke, don't even get me started).

May i ask what's a joke about VS Express? IMO they are very much capable. At least for windows forms and web-applications, never tried the c++ version. In fact it beats any other IDE i've tried anyway.

Only thing i really miss from pro is plugins, version control-integration and code contracts, the last being a thing that probably justifies a price tag anyway.

Re: It's OK for Apple to block Firefox, but wrong when Microsoft does it

#199

Post by yuhong »

kmontrose wrote: post #196
[deleted] wrote: post #191

Earlier quoted context omitted.

[deleted]

You only pay for licenses over 4 OS and 2 SQL Server (or outright new ones) after graduating BizSpark. 2 SQL Servers (OS licenses are chump change by comparison) go a loooong way* too, as you're presumably scaling up rather than out. http://www.microsoft.com/bizspark/about/Graduation.aspx Through the grapevine I hear the "review" process (for more free licenses at graduation) is extraordinarily accommodating, though…

Did not realize it changed later. Thank you.

Re: It's OK for Apple to block Firefox, but wrong when Microsoft does it

#200

Post by sses »

azakai wrote: post #137
kprobst wrote: post #124

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> What monopoly do they have? Do they not have what is essentially a monopoly on the tablet space? I'm not up to date on Android tablet market share, but it seems to me that there isn't so much a market for tablets as there is one for iPads. Everything else is pretty much nonexistent. I might be wrong about that, I guess.

http://blogs.wsj.com/digits/2012/05/03/amazons-tablet-market... Apple has 68% of the market. It's in a very powerful position, but it isn't a monopoly.

That's higher than Google's share of the US search market, according to comScore.

http://www.marketwatch.com/story/googles-web-search-market-s...

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