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Nikon to acquire RED

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Re: Nikon to acquire RED

#101

Post by dylan604 »

rangewookie wrote: post #93
ancientworldnow wrote: post #85

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I'm a colorist with over a decade experience in the industry. I work on about one hundred projects a year (film/tv/commercial/music video) and about 1-2% are canon (dslrs or otherwise). 70% are Arri, 20% Sony (either Venice or FX line), and the remainder are red. Canon has almost no presence in the professional market.

this is accurate ^ Sony is big and gaining more traction by the day. RED is very popular, Personally I know an equal number of filmmakers with RED and Sony. Arri is the premium brand. Canon is almost exclusively used in documentary these days, they had their moment with the 5DMK2 years about but squandered it. Sad really.

Canon's 5Dmk2 "moment" brought large sensor/shallow depth of field, interchangeable lenses, and very affordable pricing to a market that was dominated 2/3"-1" sensors, wide depth of field (ENG look), and high price tags.

It also brought the high contrast and saturated look baked in as a very unfriendly in post MP4 format. It also tried to sell a photo camera to a video world where the body form factor and external device connectivity was a joke. Professionals HATE all of that. Canon instead released the 100 - 700 series "cine" style bodies that were all primarily still shooting some form of MP4. It was all again a slap in the face with the added bonus of much higher price tags.

Canon has consistently told the market it doesn't understand it, and will just do what it wants

Re: Nikon to acquire RED

#103

Post by cfr2023 »

I started following the RED story before those folks ever released a camera, and I liked their spirit and mission.

Some time passed and ultimately it was Black Magic Design that accomplished what RED said they wanted to do.

If you say you want to make high end cinema technology, or even just high quality imagery, accessible to the average person, a $17,500 price tag for just the camera body shows that you might have strange ideas about what constitutes an average person.

Re: Nikon to acquire RED

#104

Post by stephen_g »

justforasingle wrote: post #24

Pretty interesting. If you look on netflix approved camera list[0] there are none from Nikon. Personally I think RED cameras are overhyped and are a major reason most netflix shows all look and feel the same. I don't think its the colour grading or lenses - its something about the camera itself that just feels shit and doesn't give me the same access to a scene the same way something like sony's HDVS from 30 years ag…

No, why “everything looks the same” is 100% down to lens, lighting and grading choices.

Part of it is that modern lenses are incredibly accurate and much better technically than they used to be - a lot of the movies that people praise the photography of are now using vintage lenses that are 30-50 years old modified to modern lens mounts, since they have “visual character” instead of being so clean.

Re: Nikon to acquire RED

#105

Post by kbf »

oven9342 wrote: post #78
justforasingle wrote: post #24

Pretty interesting. If you look on netflix approved camera list[0] there are none from Nikon. Personally I think RED cameras are overhyped and are a major reason most netflix shows all look and feel the same. I don't think its the colour grading or lenses - its something about the camera itself that just feels shit and doesn't give me the same access to a scene the same way something like sony's HDVS from 30 years ag…

When the camera pans. I find it unnerving. I don’t enjoy watching that pixelated panning. I blame it on the digital recordings. It might probably look better if they recorded it on film but no producer seems to be addressing my whimsical preferences

The Olympics are a live event, delaying the broadcast by days to cater to your niche nitpick about image quality would indeed be whimsical

Re: Nikon to acquire RED

#106

Post by staticautomatic »

mschuster91 wrote: post #98
ensignavenger wrote: post #86

Earlier quoted context omitted.

When folks talk about reliability of these cameras, what are we talking about? Like, the camera longevity, or ruggedness? Or like they reliably produce a consistent output, versus producing different results under the same conditions where one would expect consistency?

Speaking for lighting: all of it. ARRI stuff is expensive AF but worth every penny if you have the need for it.

Is this different in some way from the still photo world where you have like Broncolor that’s unreasonably expensive and no one can explain why?

Re: Nikon to acquire RED

#107

Post by stephen_g »

cfr2023 wrote: post #103

I started following the RED story before those folks ever released a camera, and I liked their spirit and mission. Some time passed and ultimately it was Black Magic Design that accomplished what RED said they wanted to do. If you say you want to make high end cinema technology, or even just high quality imagery, accessible to the average person, a $17,500 price tag for just the camera body shows that you might have…

The most affordable kinds of cameras at the time that you could realistically use for something going to theatrical release was the (1080p) Sony F900 and then F950, which were in the $250K ballpark… Then the Arri D-21 came out, I can’t even remember what price but same ballpark, it was a bit higher than 2K res. $17,500 for 4K was wild, and it was insane they actually managed to deliver it with the RED ONE.

Re: Nikon to acquire RED

#108

Post by ramesh31 »

cfr2023 wrote: post #103

I started following the RED story before those folks ever released a camera, and I liked their spirit and mission. Some time passed and ultimately it was Black Magic Design that accomplished what RED said they wanted to do. If you say you want to make high end cinema technology, or even just high quality imagery, accessible to the average person, a $17,500 price tag for just the camera body shows that you might have…

>If you say you want to make high end cinema technology, or even just high quality imagery, accessible to the average person, a $17,500 price tag for just the camera body shows that you might have strange ideas about what constitutes an average person.

To be fair, their competition at the time was $200,000+ Panavision rigs that were completely prohibitive to independent filmmakers.

Re: Nikon to acquire RED

#109

Post by dylan604 »

ChrisMarshallNY wrote: post #33
dylan604 wrote: post #19

Earlier quoted context omitted.

This will level the field? If you think Canon's cine options are equal to Red maybe it levels it. However, I think this tilts the field away from Canon to Nikon's favor while leaning more toward Sony as well than Canon. Maybe Canon can tilt it back in their favor if they were to buy Alexa.

Canon absolutely owns the video market, in many ways. Different context from RED, but you see Canon DSLR video cameras everywhere , especially consumer-level stuff, like streamcasters. Most videos you see, by semipro influencers, and whatnot, are recorded on Canon kit. Also, the TV and movie industry makes heavy use of Canon DSLR kit for their work. It’s an interesting acquisition, and I wish them luck. The rub will…

> Canon absolutely owns the video market,

Even after reading other people's comments, this statement is absolutely mind boggling to not respond to it.

> Also, the TV and movie industry makes heavy use of Canon DSLR kit for their work.

I'm going to need citations for this claim. Nobody in the TV/movie industry likes the DSLR workflows. The record format is shite. The form factor of the camera is shite. The photo lenses with a maximum rotation of 90° for pulling focus from one end to the other is absolute shite. The DSLR movement was a godsend for prosumers and the wedding photographer being taxed with also capturing video.

Re: Nikon to acquire RED

#110

Post by 10729287 »

ChrisMarshallNY wrote: post #79
timc3 wrote: post #68

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Canon has a good share of the market but not to the extent that you are suggesting. Sony is massive particularly for semipro influencers, Panasonic some share, Nikon very little. Source: Managing 150PB+ of customers video content.

Cool. Thanks for the data. Sounds like my experience is dated. I know that Sony has taken the crown for mirrorless.

Yep. It’s no more the era of 5DmkII
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