Live data from Hacker News

Apple terminates Epic Games developer account, calling it a 'threat' to iOS

techcrunch.com

41–50 of 1001 posts

Re: Apple terminates Epic Games developer account, calling it a 'threat' to iOS

#41
post #20
post #7

Sounds like they violated a non disparagement clause and signaled they will not adhere to policy. All they had to do is keep quiet and launch to minimize their liability. Guess they will need to fight in the EU to see if they can claw back.

A non-disparagement clause is not valid under the DMA.

Perhaps Apple needs to separate geographies in its account setup. Let Epic have the EU account, but disable them everywhere else.

Because in the US/Asia, Epic has no DMA protections.

Re: Apple terminates Epic Games developer account, calling it a 'threat' to iOS

#42
post #19

Earlier quoted context omitted.

This is indeed an analysis that we don't see often enough. Apple is viewed as a "tech company" and tech companies are all about innovation and growth. And their stocks are priced accordingly. But, Apple is actually extremely conservative with product rollouts and new markets (c.f. having essentially missed the boat on AI). They make phones and sell phone apps. They do a few other things, but at the end of the day the…

As long as new people are growing up, they're going to need their own phones, so there will always be a market. The same of course with many other consumer goods.

But not a growing market. You don't get a 27.27 P/E ratio by selling phones to the same fraction of the general population. Indeed, that's "the same as many other consumer goods", so go check valuations of Nestle or Proctor & Gamble or whatever.

The point is that an Apple stock priced at a level commensurate with a static market would be a catastrophic loss of shareholder value.

Re: Apple terminates Epic Games developer account, calling it a 'threat' to iOS

#43
Apple should get out of the European market entirely. Their product offering is literally incompatible with the laws that govern EU commerce.

There's plenty of money to be made in Asia/Pacific and the Americas.

Apple's walled-garden approach is innovative especially on the security and stability fronts and anyone who doesn't like that or wants alternative launchers should jailbreak their ios device or just use Android, which does fit better into EU market.

Apple has literally never cared and should never care what outside bodies (including to a large degree -- their own customers) want their products to be. It's what has made them unique in the past.

If Apple backs down on their vision then they are no longer Apple.

Re: Apple terminates Epic Games developer account, calling it a 'threat' to iOS

#45
I wonder why Apple doesn't open up their platforms to have everything best on their devices instead of fighting and agonising developers and governments. Yes yes, the commission is nice but they might be killing the goose that lays the golden eggs.

I mean, Apple is amazingly good in some areas but in some other areas their products are used only because they don't give a choice and they intent to keep it this way. They also want to control everything and provide all the services.

A bit short sighted and futile IMHO because the competition is catching up with their user experience but Apple doesn't catch up as quickly with the "smart" bits of the modern tech.

I recall a Steve Jobs speech about Apple doing a few things %20 better and other things worse and how he intents to change this by embracing the industry standards because they simply can't do everything by themselves.

I feel like Apple is doing the same mistake again where their products are becoming slightly better at few things and worse in others simply because you can't have the better stuff installed on Apple devices.

Re: Apple terminates Epic Games developer account, calling it a 'threat' to iOS

#46

Whether or not Tim Sweeney has a legal leg to stand on, I'm so happy he keeps fighting this. Likewise with Spotify. I love that the EU is pushing legislation to give at least some people back control of their devices. I'm curious why Tim Cook thinks Apple can continue to treat developers they way they do for years on end and it won't slowly but surely come to bite them hard one day.

Look, this is confusing. Can I just call them Tim Epic and Tim Apple?

Re: Apple terminates Epic Games developer account, calling it a 'threat' to iOS

#47

If I had a Customer that spent years relentlessly complaining about my Company, I know I wouldn't want to have them as a Customer. It does present an interesting question on whether a Company can be forced to have a bad actor as a Customer, I guess this will be decided in the lawsuits to come.

Companies in quite a few industries have a duty to do business with you, with very few limitations. For example, in some countries/cities, taxis generally can't refuse transportation to you, assuming you're able to pay and not endangering the driver. Having publicly and repeatedly expressed a dislike for taxis, or even wearing a t-shirt saying "taxis in $city are an overpriced monopoly" would not be a valid reason to be refused transportation.

In the EU/under the DMA, Apple now very likely has a duty to transact even with app developers saying mean things about them. That's certainly a very new situation for Apple, but not an unprecedented one.

I'm not sure if throwing more hissy fits and breaking more of their playmates' toys is a good idea now that adults are in the room.

Re: Apple terminates Epic Games developer account, calling it a 'threat' to iOS

#48
post #23

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Their terms are not relevant, Apple has no authority over the DMA.

so if I set up my own app store with nothing but apps designed to scam people, Apple has to allow me to do it?

You could, but few people are going to fall for that. Are you offering something that would entice people away, something huge like Fortnite? Most non-technical people will stick with the App store.

Re: Apple terminates Epic Games developer account, calling it a 'threat' to iOS

#49
post #19
post #3

Why are investors seemingly blind to the fact that Apple is fighting tooth and nail to protect their App Store revenue (while looking like jackasses in the court of public opinion and pissing off regulators and their relationship with developers) because if the App Store money in their pocket dries up, all hell breaks loose because all of their hardware products are no longer growing. The stock will crash and the exe…

This is indeed an analysis that we don't see often enough. Apple is viewed as a "tech company" and tech companies are all about innovation and growth. And their stocks are priced accordingly. But, Apple is actually extremely conservative with product rollouts and new markets (c.f. having essentially missed the boat on AI). They make phones and sell phone apps. They do a few other things, but at the end of the day the…

> c.f. having essentially missed the boat on AI

What boat? Not being first to market with a fancy commercial-grade model and charging $20/mo for consumer-style access (a la OpenAI)? Not having a cloud offering (MS, etc)? Not having a fancy in-your-pocket AI (like… no one? Siri is behind the times, and a better Siri would be great, but IMO the issue isn’t so much the quality of the language model but that Siri is oddly limited in what it can interact with).

I agree that Apple hasn’t been amazingly innovative in the last few years, but being off the AI hype boat seems off the mark.

Re: Apple terminates Epic Games developer account, calling it a 'threat' to iOS

#50
post #21
post #7

Sounds like they violated a non disparagement clause and signaled they will not adhere to policy. All they had to do is keep quiet and launch to minimize their liability. Guess they will need to fight in the EU to see if they can claw back.

There's no chance the DMA includes a non disparagement clause. That's totally against free speech.

Free speech has nothing to do with any of this
Post reply on HN