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European crash tester says carmakers must bring back physical controls

arstechnica.com

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Re: European crash tester says carmakers must bring back physical controls

#601

Post by dzikimarian »

vel0city wrote: post #555
Toutouxc wrote: post #545

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> I don't understand how so many people have come across cars with seemingly terrible auto AC systems. > Whenever I rent a car it's always infuriating having to constantly muck with the AC system. Am I missing something or do these not make sense together?

I guess I should have phrased it as "chosen to own cars with seemingly terrible AC systems". Theromostatic controls are pretty cheap to implement, its not like you'd need some high-end extreme luxury car to have that feature be normal. If the AC controls are on a touchscreen, chances are they're auto. If they're auto, you probably shouldn't have to mess with them at all while moving.

You need at least sun direction, temperature and humidity sensors and reasonable software behind them to have good automatic AC.

Basic thermostat is somewhere in center console, which doesn't help much if your chest is blasted with sun. Also temperature you feel is different depending on humidity.

Re: European crash tester says carmakers must bring back physical controls

#602

Post by ChrisMarshallNY »

Animats wrote: post #201
userbinator wrote: post #131

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Touché! It's interesting how early vehicles were very different in their controls, but seemed to mostly converge and stabilise for a few decades, before again diverging and changing rapidly. The Model T (Ford) had a throttle on the steering wheel and 3 pedals, but not the ones you'd expect today: https://www.fordmodelt.net/images/ford-model-t-controls_smal...

> but seemed to mostly converge and stabilise for a few decades Due to regulation. The US Congress mandated the PRNDSL quadrant for automatic transmissions. (GM had PNDSLR, and people kept shifting into reverse by accident.)

I drove stick for most of my early driving years, and they were all over the place.

Re: European crash tester says carmakers must bring back physical controls

#603

Post by adwf »

speedgoose wrote: post #167
croes wrote: post #149

Earlier quoted context omitted.

How about buying an other car?

The challenge is that other cars are either worse or more expensive. A Tesla with some aftermarket modes (the sexy buttons for example) is still interesting despite its shortcomings. The perfect product doesn’t exists.

Exactly. I love the car in so many other ways that it just really makes some decisions stand out as ridiculous. Why try and skimp $50 manufacturing cost on stalks and sensors in a $50k vehicle when it's otherwise such a great car?

Ultimately poor wiper controls and fixed headrests are hardly the end of the world, but they could trivially make it so much better...

Re: European crash tester says carmakers must bring back physical controls

#604

Post by vel0city »

dzikimarian wrote: post #601
vel0city wrote: post #555

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I guess I should have phrased it as "chosen to own cars with seemingly terrible AC systems". Theromostatic controls are pretty cheap to implement, its not like you'd need some high-end extreme luxury car to have that feature be normal. If the AC controls are on a touchscreen, chances are they're auto. If they're auto, you probably shouldn't have to mess with them at all while moving.

You need at least sun direction, temperature and humidity sensors and reasonable software behind them to have good automatic AC. Basic thermostat is somewhere in center console, which doesn't help much if your chest is blasted with sun. Also temperature you feel is different depending on humidity.

I live in North Texas. I guarantee you we get a lot of days with intense radiant heat.

Both of my cars have glass roofs. Previously they had sunroofs. Lots of sunlight in the cabin.

I haven't had issues with automatic AC in decades in cars that aren't exactly luxury cars. It is a solved problem for at least every brand of car I've owned.

Re: European crash tester says carmakers must bring back physical controls

#605

Post by frumper »

sensanaty wrote: post #310
darkwater wrote: post #256

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I had cars in which for the life of me I could not ever remember which part of which stalk controlled the wipers and which part controlled the lights. Ah, and then there are Volkswagen and Opel which had the light control as a wheel outside the wheel-drive, on the bottom left, and you had to take a hand off to modify it. My point: just having physical controls doesn't mean it is easy or safe to use, if the layout suc…

I haven't driven that many different cars in my life, but isn't it usually the stick on the same side as the driver's seat? Aka if the driver's seat is on the right, then the blinkers are on the right, and the other way around in left-seated cars? I switch between Indonesia and EU fairly often and most cars I've driven followed that pattern as far as I can remember (maybe I just never noticed though)

My wife's car has a stalk that you can turn the end, turn the inside. It has a slide that moves up and down inside of the inside rotating part. The stalk can go up, or down, or double up. You can also pull the stalk towards you. It's bonkers.

Re: European crash tester says carmakers must bring back physical controls

#606

Post by ProllyInfamous »

culopatin wrote: post #80
tristor wrote: post #66

This was the primary reason I bought my 2024 Mazda3, instead of alternatives in market. The Mazda was the only option that had physical controls for everything. In fact it disables the touch screen altogether when you exceed 10mph, forcing the use of physical controls. It works flawlessly with wireless carplay

The Mazda 3 is such a pretty car in and out. I wish there was an AWD turbo manual or a fully electric one. Either one will make me replace the Prius.

I test drove a Prius, then bought a Camry Hybrid (2021).

It has physical buttons for everything except the radio... much better vehicle.

Re: European crash tester says carmakers must bring back physical controls

#607

Post by [deleted] »

amenhotep wrote: post #379
rad_gruchalski wrote: post #233

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> Remember to press both left and center pedals to stop To stop, not to slow down.

It's still not correct. You press the brake to stop. You press the clutch to not stall. They're separate concerns, or maybe more accurately one is only a response to the other - you clutch as you're about to stop because otherwise you'll stall, you don't brake and clutch at the same time because you decide to stop and not stall at the same time.

[deleted]

Re: European crash tester says carmakers must bring back physical controls

#608

Post by ProllyInfamous »

freeAgent wrote: post #294
speedgoose wrote: post #161

Earlier quoted context omitted.

They do sell en EV in some places, the MX-30. It’s a terrible EV that was outdated before its release, so that’s perhaps why they don’t try to sell it more. We are talking about the company that still invest in internal combustion engines so don’t have too high hopes.

They are partnering with Toyota on future EVs, not that Toyota has been a leader there either…

Toyota has not been a leader in full-EVs because they believe that most customers want a non-charging hybrid solution — one they "just put gas in to" and forget about anything else.

IMHO, this is the correct solution for all but a handful of commuters (e.g. a WFH citydweller could probably enjoy a full EV, but not for vacations).

Re: European crash tester says carmakers must bring back physical controls

#609

Post by culopatin »

ProllyInfamous wrote: post #606
culopatin wrote: post #80

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The Mazda 3 is such a pretty car in and out. I wish there was an AWD turbo manual or a fully electric one. Either one will make me replace the Prius.

I test drove a Prius, then bought a Camry Hybrid (2021). It has physical buttons for everything except the radio... much better vehicle.

Completely different category too. It’s too long and drives like a boat for what I like.

Re: European crash tester says carmakers must bring back physical controls

#610

Post by rad_gruchalski »

amenhotep wrote: post #379
rad_gruchalski wrote: post #233

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> Remember to press both left and center pedals to stop To stop, not to slow down.

It's still not correct. You press the brake to stop. You press the clutch to not stall. They're separate concerns, or maybe more accurately one is only a response to the other - you clutch as you're about to stop because otherwise you'll stall, you don't brake and clutch at the same time because you decide to stop and not stall at the same time.

Yes: to STOP. Your answer is just pedantry.

One can also just put the car in neutral and let it roll to stop occasionally correcting with the break pedal, if we want to be pedantic.

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