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Nvidia bans using translation layers for CUDA software to run on other chips

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Re: Nvidia bans using translation layers for CUDA software to run on other chips

#31
post #4

People keep using proprietary software and keep getting burned by it. When will we learn?

Hopefully Vulkan eventually gets a headless compute kernel version.

Vulkan has always supported headless mode, everything related to graphics and presentation is optional.

It has a way to go before its compute model is as powerful and easy to use as CUDA is though.

Re: Nvidia bans using translation layers for CUDA software to run on other chips

#32
post #6

> a new clause in CUDA 11.5 reads Huh? That was released like 3 years ago.

The license was indeed last updated in October 8th 2021 with the release of Cuda 11.5.0. I guess nobody noticed until now? https://docs.nvidia.com/cuda/eula/index.html

Re: Nvidia bans using translation layers for CUDA software to run on other chips

#33
Their ban is legal, not enforced in code. I wish them best of luck enforcing those terms and conditions against Chinese hardware makers in China. And even Nvidia would know that the European competition regulator would take a dim view of it. I guess there is some benefit to dragging it out, benefiting from the CUDA monopoly for a year or two more.

Re: Nvidia bans using translation layers for CUDA software to run on other chips

#34
This just seems to be a poorly researched knee-jerk article written based on a single off-hand tweet from 2 weeks ago, citing a clause that has been around for years, and thus obviously is not in response to something talked about 3 weeks ago.

As an example, the license here has the exact phrase, on a file last changed 2 years ago: https://github.com/NVIDIA/spark-rapids-container/blob/dev/NO...

The EULA here, listed as last updated in 2021, also has this clause: https://docs.nvidia.com/cuda/eula/index.html

Re: Nvidia bans using translation layers for CUDA software to run on other chips

#35
post #4

People keep using proprietary software and keep getting burned by it. When will we learn?

If people were going to learn not to use proprietary software/hardware like the stuff that the wankers at Nvidia churn out, they'd have learned it over a decade ago when Torvalds gave them a big "fuck you" - which had been a long time coming even back then. People who keep picking Nvidia don't want to learn not to use proprietary tools.

That's a bit like saying "the slaves in the roman silver mines didn't want to rebel." Maybe a decade ago it was because they didn't care about abstract ideals like software freedom, but now they are well and truly stuck, and can serve only as a cautionary tale to other industries.

Re: Nvidia bans using translation layers for CUDA software to run on other chips

#38

IANAL, but I don't see how this can be enforced (in the US) given the legal history of emulation. This is effectively just emulation. c.f., https://emulation.gametechwiki.com/index.php/Licensing

I think they're trying to do the trick where they don't ban the emulation per se, but they make it a violation of the license to disassemble the code to understand how it works. Then they go after emulating projects for copyright infringement, since they must have violated copyright to get a compatible version running. It's a dirty trick IMO, but it has seen some mixed success.

So they just put up their hand and said they also want to give the EU money?

Re: Nvidia bans using translation layers for CUDA software to run on other chips

#39

IANAL, but I don't see how this can be enforced (in the US) given the legal history of emulation. This is effectively just emulation. c.f., https://emulation.gametechwiki.com/index.php/Licensing

APIs aren't subject to copyright. So unless CUDA is more than an API they're just going to make some lawyers rich and waste everyone's time.

Making lawyers rich to waste time is how super rich companies stifle competition...

Re: Nvidia bans using translation layers for CUDA software to run on other chips

#40

IANAL, but I don't see how this can be enforced (in the US) given the legal history of emulation. This is effectively just emulation. c.f., https://emulation.gametechwiki.com/index.php/Licensing

I think they're trying to do the trick where they don't ban the emulation per se, but they make it a violation of the license to disassemble the code to understand how it works. Then they go after emulating projects for copyright infringement, since they must have violated copyright to get a compatible version running. It's a dirty trick IMO, but it has seen some mixed success.

Clean-room reverse engineering is specifically not forbidden, and has been successfully done in the past to develop the Nouveau driver. Disassembling Nvidia's binaries is plausibly forbidden, but it would be very surprising if they could extend that ban on binaries produced by their compiler. However, the trademark could be used to attack statements about the emulation layer. I see parallels to Google vs. Oracle
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