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Love, Internet Style

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Re: Love, Internet Style

#21

Post by stcredzero »

sidsavara wrote: post #2

This is actually a really great discussion on community support for software development versus "corporate" support, using a really interesting metaphor of a japanese shrine. I enjoyed the video and am voting it up, but I think you should change the title, because I was expecting some cheesy dating video... ..I know, what does that say about me, that THINKING that, I still clicked through... Perhaps add to the end of…

This is a key notion with regards to the success of programming languages. Programming languages are only partly a technological artifact. The sociological and cultural aspects are just as important, if not more so.

Re: Love, Internet Style

#22

Post by nihilocrat »

tremendo wrote: post #5
sidsavara wrote: post #2

This is actually a really great discussion on community support for software development versus "corporate" support, using a really interesting metaphor of a japanese shrine. I enjoyed the video and am voting it up, but I think you should change the title, because I was expecting some cheesy dating video... ..I know, what does that say about me, that THINKING that, I still clicked through... Perhaps add to the end of…

+1. By title alone I would have never cared. Only because it's here in HN did I click through to these comments and based on yours I decided to actually watch the video. It's a 9 min talk by Clay Shirky basically praising the hacker spirit.

It also has some takeaway about how to build your product.

Make a product which the users are going to be excited about and want to preserve, so they will help other people trying to use it.

There seem to be enough people around who don't get that, that it's a non-obvious insight. It's probably because they are just like the "C++ people" in the story, though; they've already made up their minds before you started talking to them.

Re: Love, Internet Style

#23

Post by nihilocrat »

kqr2 wrote: post #10

Ise Shrine which Clay Shirky mentions: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ise_Shrine It is rebuilt every 20 years and is on iteration 61.

The fact that a big part of the tradition is "passing on" the techniques used to build the shrine reminds me of this: http://xkcd.com/297/

Re: Love, Internet Style

#24

Post by jimbokun »

What a wonderful sermon.

In today's society, when we want to criticize some kind of discourse we often say it is "preachy," implying like a sermon, which is understood to be the lowest form of human communication or something.

I never understood that mindset. As Clay Shirky demonstrates here, the sermon can be the most uplifting and inspiring and motivating form of communication we have. Turning off the brain is not inherent in the form at all, quite the opposite.

As another example, Barack Obama's oratory is undeniably influenced and inspired by sermons. Particularly, the African American sermon, perhaps the highest form of this art. The obvious example being Martin Luther King, Jr., a good candidate for greatest speaker of the 20th century.

And if you don't think Clay Shirky's talk here is sermon like, may I suggest you just haven't heard many sermons, or at least not many good ones.

Re: Love, Internet Style

#25

Post by rcoder »

The most salient point, to my mind, was this line: "they didn't care that they saw it work in practice, since they already knew it couldn't work in theory."

That, and "Perl is a Shinto shrine." Larry Wall himself could hardly spin a better catchphrase.

Re: Love, Internet Style

#27

Post by lsb »

peregrine wrote: post #4

I should send this to people at work, probably call me gay. :)

Colin Powell: Well, the correct answer is, he is not a Muslim, he's a Christian. He's always been a Christian. But the really right answer is, what if he is? Is there something wrong with being a Muslim in this country? The answer's no, that's not America.

Same with being gay.

Re: Love, Internet Style

#28

Post by pistoriusp »

pistoriusp wrote: post #11

This is off-topic, but does anyone else think Clay Shirky looks like Tom Hanks in this video?

I'm not the only person who thinks so:

  "Clay Shirky looked like Tom Hanks but I didn't ask him about his latest movie role (I hope)."
(http://terranova.blogs.com/terra_nova/2003/11/usercreated_co...)

  "If Shirky ever has a movie made of his life, it’ll have to 
  be Tom Hanks that stars. I think he sounds and looks a lot like Shirky!"
(http://blogs.technet.com/johmar/archive/2008/09/18/web-2-0-e...)

  "Imagine hair on him and Shirky looks, talks and acts exactly like Tom Hanks. Not just similar, but eerily exact."
(http://www.chrisroberson.net/2008/04/cognitive-surplus.html)

  "One thing I’ve definitely gotta say about this guy though is that he sounds 
  and looks a lot like Tom Hanks. Not that there’s anything wrong with that."
(http://www.warrenellis.com/?p=5885#comment-229940)

Re: Love, Internet Style

#30

Post by jmtulloss »

jimbokun wrote: post #24

What a wonderful sermon. In today's society, when we want to criticize some kind of discourse we often say it is "preachy," implying like a sermon, which is understood to be the lowest form of human communication or something. I never understood that mindset. As Clay Shirky demonstrates here, the sermon can be the most uplifting and inspiring and motivating form of communication we have. Turning off the brain is not…

I like how your first line is a response and the rest is a preemptive defense of the response.

I do agree with you though.

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