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Why do east Asian firms value drinking?

ggd.world

11–20 of 190 posts

Re: Why do east Asian firms value drinking?

#11
post #4

In its extreme alcohol is a truth serum. The ones who don't drink want to keep their secrets to themselves and can't be trusted.

By that logic, the ones who don't drink should be handed the most secretive, important projects.

Whole lot of Mormons working for CIA and NSA. Just sayin.

Re: Why do east Asian firms value drinking?

#12
post #3
post #2

Even in the US, in tech firms, it's pretty common to have happy hours where everyone drinks a bit. I don't drink at all due to my sleep apnea, and don't even have caffeine after 1pm for the same reason, so I'm pretty much always in this kind of awkward position of sipping on a water throughout the night while coworkers get more and more inebriated. I don't think it's ever directly hurt my chances of promotion or anyt…

there are plenty of other beverages that aren't alcoholic/caffeinated than just plain water

Strange but true: I've been to a number of professional happy hours that offered free alcohol, but didn't provide other beverages. It got to the point that I started bringing my own water bottle to networking events, just in case.

I'm a big fan of providing other beverage types. Being able to sip a soda etc from the same kind of container as everyone else goes a long way towards blending in.

Re: Why do east Asian firms value drinking?

#13
> The Dutch and Israelis are famously direct. They don’t mind confrontation, so usually speak their mind and take no offence. By contrast, East Asians are more likely to value collective harmony. This means that they avoid direct confrontation, so artfully use be more subtle and diplomatic language.

I don't see how speaking your mind is confrontational or at odds with "collective harmony". Intention is all that matters in my opinion. If you go in aiming to upset, then you're a dick and no amount of "diplomatic language" is going to make you not a dick. In fact, it will only make you more dickish, because now you're hiding behind word manipulation.

Re: Why do east Asian firms value drinking?

#14
post #4

In its extreme alcohol is a truth serum. The ones who don't drink want to keep their secrets to themselves and can't be trusted.

By that logic, the ones who don't drink should be handed the most secretive, important projects.

Well, one topic which is covered in some detail when you are screened for security clearances is precisely how you use alcohol (and other intoxicants!).

I imagine it is for this precise reason.

Re: Why do east Asian firms value drinking?

#15
post #3

Earlier quoted context omitted.

there are plenty of other beverages that aren't alcoholic/caffeinated than just plain water

Do you think they would have a better time if they were drinking a sprite or something? Being with drunk people when you're sober is not fun for either party regardless.

Drinkers also don't like having teetotalers around them because of the bad conscience they induce.

Re: Why do east Asian firms value drinking?

#16
post #13

> The Dutch and Israelis are famously direct. They don’t mind confrontation, so usually speak their mind and take no offence. By contrast, East Asians are more likely to value collective harmony. This means that they avoid direct confrontation, so artfully use be more subtle and diplomatic language. I don't see how speaking your mind is confrontational or at odds with "collective harmony". Intention is all that matte…

> I don't see how speaking your mind is confrontational or at odds with "collective harmony". Intention is all that matters in my opinion.

Even in Western cultures, if you try saying something at odds with the "room" or the current bandwagon, like here on HN for example, you will feel the frowns coming your way.

Re: Why do east Asian firms value drinking?

#17
post #3
post #2

Even in the US, in tech firms, it's pretty common to have happy hours where everyone drinks a bit. I don't drink at all due to my sleep apnea, and don't even have caffeine after 1pm for the same reason, so I'm pretty much always in this kind of awkward position of sipping on a water throughout the night while coworkers get more and more inebriated. I don't think it's ever directly hurt my chances of promotion or anyt…

there are plenty of other beverages that aren't alcoholic/caffeinated than just plain water

There should be a (weak) mushroom tea alternative at such events, I think.

Re: Why do east Asian firms value drinking?

#19
post #13

> The Dutch and Israelis are famously direct. They don’t mind confrontation, so usually speak their mind and take no offence. By contrast, East Asians are more likely to value collective harmony. This means that they avoid direct confrontation, so artfully use be more subtle and diplomatic language. I don't see how speaking your mind is confrontational or at odds with "collective harmony". Intention is all that matte…

> I don't see how speaking your mind is confrontational or at odds with "collective harmony". Intention is all that matters in my opinion. Even in Western cultures, if you try saying something at odds with the "room" or the current bandwagon, like here on HN for example, you will feel the frowns coming your way.

Meh, different life experiences then. I've never had any trouble with it. Then again I could be autistic and haven't noticed / cared.

In a business setting, the room should bend to facts, not group-think.

Re: Why do east Asian firms value drinking?

#20
post #5

This presentation from the Long Now Foundation makes the proposition that drinking helps create society https://longnow.org/ideas/drinking-10000-years-intoxication-... > Drawing on evidence from archaeology, history, cognitive neuroscience, psychopharmacology, social psychology, literature, and genetics, Slingerland shows that our taste for chemical intoxicants is not an evolutionary mistake, as we are so often told.…

see also https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=36494466

(in western firms, compare "what gets said in Powerpoint" vs "what gets said on Slack")

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