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California Approves Waymo Expansion to Los Angeles and SF Peninsula [pdf]

cpuc.ca.gov

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Re: California Approves Waymo Expansion to Los Angeles and SF Peninsula [pdf]

#71

Post by JumpCrisscross »

dangus wrote: post #56
whimsicalism wrote: post #45

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Having a car to yourself is honestly just way better, maybe I'm just antisocial Like I will easily pay a premium to have self-driving most of the time. I can play my music on the speakers, I can work more comfortably in the car, etc. etc. Also, I find Uber drivers are pretty bad drivers often - comparative advantage

Owning a car yourself is the most costly option, so I would hope that it is the “best.” Purchase price, depreciation, maintenance, insurance, fuel. Edit: to be clear I’m putting “best” in quotes because personal car ownership is pretty terrible in terms of value.

> Owning a car yourself is the most costly option, so I would hope that it is the “best.”

I drove a car into San Francisco once. Never again. Not having to worry about parking, being able to nap or work en route, not having to get stressed by traffic, etc. Massive improvement in QOL.

Re: California Approves Waymo Expansion to Los Angeles and SF Peninsula [pdf]

#72

Post by deprecative »

whimsicalism wrote: post #45
tempest_ wrote: post #24

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> people underestimate how much of a quality of life improvement these are for people even when compared to Uber/Lyft I do underestimate it. What are quality of life improvements? Seems to be the same thing from a customer perspective. I guess if you are concerned for your safety from the uber driver it is an improvement but it is the only one that comes to mind.

Having a car to yourself is honestly just way better, maybe I'm just antisocial Like I will easily pay a premium to have self-driving most of the time. I can play my music on the speakers, I can work more comfortably in the car, etc. etc. Also, I find Uber drivers are pretty bad drivers often - comparative advantage

It's pedantic to most, I'm sure. Just FYI, though, antisocial is to be opposed to society - like Timothy McVeigh. Asocial is probably what you're looking for.

Re: California Approves Waymo Expansion to Los Angeles and SF Peninsula [pdf]

#73

Post by pkaye »

bossyTeacher wrote: post #33
Kronopath wrote: post #15

Earlier quoted context omitted.

In SF, up-front prices have been comparable to Uber’s, except that you don’t have to pay tip, which automatically makes it 15–20% cheaper. The few times I’ve tried it, the service has been good and its driving was safe. The only downside is that there seems to sometimes be longer wait times.

In europe, you don't pay tips to uber drivers. Surely, if the tip is compulsory, it should be called a service fee

Uber didn't originally have tips but the US Uber drivers wanted tips and pushed to implement it.

Re: California Approves Waymo Expansion to Los Angeles and SF Peninsula [pdf]

#74

Post by seanmcdirmid »

dangus wrote: post #48
NewJazz wrote: post #39

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Yeah that one comes to mind. Personal safety is often a factor influencing public transit decisions as well.

Private transit*. Uber and Waymo are private transit. Something to note is that actual public transit (buses and trains) has something like 10x fewer annual deaths than private vehicles, because fatal accidents almost never happen in them. Personal safety is a much less statistically relevant concern compared to personal injury.

> Something to note is that actual public transit (buses and trains) has something like 10x fewer annual deaths than private vehicles, because fatal accidents almost never happen in them.

I've never had a fent zombie wave a knife in my face on private transit, but it has happened a couple of times on public transit. I get that it is technically "safer", but we have a long way to go before normal people will feel safe on it (in the states, other countries obviously do this better by not allowing their buses and light rail to be turned into roving day centers).

Re: California Approves Waymo Expansion to Los Angeles and SF Peninsula [pdf]

#75

Post by waych »

singleshot_ wrote: post #60
tempest_ wrote: post #24

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> people underestimate how much of a quality of life improvement these are for people even when compared to Uber/Lyft I do underestimate it. What are quality of life improvements? Seems to be the same thing from a customer perspective. I guess if you are concerned for your safety from the uber driver it is an improvement but it is the only one that comes to mind.

I don’t need to be given a numeric rating by my chauffeur on how well I sit in the back of a car. The social play-acting part of ridesharing apps became exhausting to me (admittedly: an introvert) sometime during the first ride.

Is it better to leave it to an AI algorithm watching you in the back of the car? One way or another passengers are going to get rated.

Re: California Approves Waymo Expansion to Los Angeles and SF Peninsula [pdf]

#76

Post by sixothree »

austinkhale wrote: post #8

Fantastic news. I use them all the time in Phoenix. My mom uses them to get to her doctor appointments. I think people underestimate how much of a quality of life improvement these are for people even when compared to Uber/Lyft.

How does the pricing compare?

Re: California Approves Waymo Expansion to Los Angeles and SF Peninsula [pdf]

#77

Post by deprecative »

dangus wrote: post #48
NewJazz wrote: post #39

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Yeah that one comes to mind. Personal safety is often a factor influencing public transit decisions as well.

Private transit*. Uber and Waymo are private transit. Something to note is that actual public transit (buses and trains) has something like 10x fewer annual deaths than private vehicles, because fatal accidents almost never happen in them. Personal safety is a much less statistically relevant concern compared to personal injury.

Yeah, but public transit is socialist and helps the poor and minorities so we can't have that in the states beyond the massive cities that more or less force the issue.

The distinction is absolutely important between public and private transit. However to most folks they'll be the same thing in the end. Maybe local governments can buy cars for private public transit, which could be nice depending on funding and all that.

Re: California Approves Waymo Expansion to Los Angeles and SF Peninsula [pdf]

#78

Post by andrewprock »

dangus wrote: post #56
whimsicalism wrote: post #45

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Having a car to yourself is honestly just way better, maybe I'm just antisocial Like I will easily pay a premium to have self-driving most of the time. I can play my music on the speakers, I can work more comfortably in the car, etc. etc. Also, I find Uber drivers are pretty bad drivers often - comparative advantage

Owning a car yourself is the most costly option, so I would hope that it is the “best.” Purchase price, depreciation, maintenance, insurance, fuel. Edit: to be clear I’m putting “best” in quotes because personal car ownership is pretty terrible in terms of value.

If you pay a lot for parking or don't use the car much this tracks. But if you have the volume, then owning a car is cheaper.

An affordable mid size car costs roughly $6k per year total cost for a new car, and about 2/3 that for a used car.

If you commute daily to work, that is 500 trips per year. Two weekend trips adds another 100 per year. Now we are talking about ~$10/trip if you own your car.

When you add the premium value you get from flexibility, then it's an even better deal. If you only drive 50x a year then yeah, just use services.

Re: California Approves Waymo Expansion to Los Angeles and SF Peninsula [pdf]

#79

Post by fiddlerwoaroof »

waych wrote: post #75
singleshot_ wrote: post #60

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I don’t need to be given a numeric rating by my chauffeur on how well I sit in the back of a car. The social play-acting part of ridesharing apps became exhausting to me (admittedly: an introvert) sometime during the first ride.

Is it better to leave it to an AI algorithm watching you in the back of the car? One way or another passengers are going to get rated.

Yeah, imagine losing your gmail account due to some automated system malfunctioning and simultaneously losing access to the transportation system you depend on.

Re: California Approves Waymo Expansion to Los Angeles and SF Peninsula [pdf]

#80

Post by pokstad »

tempest_ wrote: post #24
austinkhale wrote: post #8

Fantastic news. I use them all the time in Phoenix. My mom uses them to get to her doctor appointments. I think people underestimate how much of a quality of life improvement these are for people even when compared to Uber/Lyft.

> people underestimate how much of a quality of life improvement these are for people even when compared to Uber/Lyft I do underestimate it. What are quality of life improvements? Seems to be the same thing from a customer perspective. I guess if you are concerned for your safety from the uber driver it is an improvement but it is the only one that comes to mind.

George Hotz said it best: “self driving is already here, it’s called Uber”
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