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Are US EV sales a disaster or a booming segment? The answer may be both

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Re: Are US EV sales a disaster or a booming segment? The answer may be both

#51

Post by mook »

api wrote: post #29
ProfessorLayton wrote: post #24

EVs are still too compromising or expensive. All I want is an electric no-frills version of my Civic at a comparable price. Honda themselves, or any other manufacturer, have been unable to offer that. I have no interest in buying another ICE vehicle, so I'll continue to maintain my current car, but I'm ready to buy once they offer something I'm looking for.

> All I want is an electric no-frills version of my Civic at a comparable price. The US car industry seems really determined not to allow anything affordable on the market. It's not just EVs. They also push overpriced bloated gas guzzlers. Eventually someone will get a cheap reliable decent-range EV like you want into the market and steamroll the entire industry.

Wasn't that basically why the Japanese cars got popular way back? Because they were cheaper and more efficient (and gas was getting expensive)?

This time around the Japanese have been assimilated; it looks like it'll have to be the Chinese to make useful cars.

Re: Are US EV sales a disaster or a booming segment? The answer may be both

#52

Post by dkobia »

fumar wrote: post #36

Isn’t the automotive space filled with lobbyists wanting to maintain the status quo? I’ve witness many families go electric and none have gone back. Self selected bias? I’ve had an EV for over seven years now. We are on our second Tesla and looking at a Rivian. I could not go back to an ICE vehicle and this is coming from a long time automotive enthusiast who has competed in rallys and track events. For my family’s l…

If you own a house, an EV is a no brainer. I drive an ICE vehicle and my wife drives an EV. My car feels like antiquated technology after driving the EV. It is hard to describe how simple, cheap and fun they are to operate. To date we haven't had to use a charging station because charging at home or at the office (for free) has been sufficient. We had range anxiety maybe the first few weeks but that is long gone. It just works.

Re: Are US EV sales a disaster or a booming segment? The answer may be both

#54

Post by happytiger »

bequanna wrote: post #26
happytiger wrote: post #21

I will never buy and EV as long as I’m beholden to the tyranny of PG&E’s constant gamification of my power. They keep raising and raising prices and there’s nothing attractive about putting all my eggs in the electric basket in California as long as the rates are controlled by cartels. PG&E will exploit any electric car progress for themselves and rip off their customers as hard as they can as soon as they thought th…

Isn’t this rate jump partially the result of rulings that made PG&E liable for damages from fires started by overheated transformers?

Indeed. That was the story. The reality is after all these rate hikes PG&E, which so desperately complained about their future being in jeopardy, forcing worker concessions, and undergoing a 58 billion dollar wildfire fueled restructuring, paid their CEO more than 40 million dollars and cleared more than 25 percent pure profit last quarter.

Oh, and this most recent rate hike was justified to bury cables. All while becoming the most expensive provider in California.

And did I mention that, after announcing a massive across the board rate hike, they decided to start the very expensive program of giving dividends to stock holders.

But wait! THEN they announced that instead of paying for what you use, you’re going to pay for how much money you earn and that you would now need to report income to them like they are the Government. A private corporation? Every rate payer pays on household incomes?!? What?

https://www.ewg.org/news-insights/news-release/2022/10/ratep....

https://www.spglobal.com/marketintelligence/en/news-insights...

https://www.nbclosangeles.com/investigations/national-invest...

We’re rewarding failure and the utility is killing people.

Re: Are US EV sales a disaster or a booming segment? The answer may be both

#55

Post by ghaff »

jajko wrote: post #47
reducesuffering wrote: post #19

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> having to find a charging station for your EV and having to sit there for an hour or longer A Tesla can supercharge 200 miles in 15 minutes

Here in Geneva, Switzerland there is exactly one place with superchargers, metro area easily over 1.5 million and some of the wealthiest and most powerful folks live here or often move through here. I think they have 24 chargers altogether in that spot. Next nearest in Switzerland is some 120km away. That's basically a non-existent network. Colleague who has model S told me he can charge at his house cca 9km/hour. Wi…

To be fair service outside of warranty for luxury cars in general is pretty sky high, especially absent a trusted independent mechanic who you can work with.

But, yeah, I haven't seriously considered an EV. There isn't a model in my sweet spot, I don't drive much on a day-to-day basis and, when I do, it can be fairly long drives to fairly remote areas. Maybe someday but I'm either on a road trip or fuel stops are generally weeeks apart from each other.

Re: Are US EV sales a disaster or a booming segment? The answer may be both

#56

Post by freetime2 »

Melmolo wrote: post #8

It's really unfortunate for others that there are still that many hurdles. My ev is so more agile and makes a lot of fun. True not cheap and getting the electric right was like 1.5k on top but hey still a ton cheaper than a normal car with speeds anything close to my ev.

I get that there are lot of people who like to drive fun cars, and I have no problem with that (as long as they obey traffic laws and drive safely on public roads), but for me speed, agility, and fun are pretty low on my list of priorities in a car. I would rank practicality, safety, comfort, and affordability well above speed.

For me there aren't any EVs on the market that hit the balance of practicality, comfort, and affordability that I am looking for. I'm still optimistic though that by the time I am ready to replace my current car, there might at least be options worth considering.

Re: Are US EV sales a disaster or a booming segment? The answer may be both

#57

Post by happytiger »

f0e4c2f7 wrote: post #45
happytiger wrote: post #21

I will never buy and EV as long as I’m beholden to the tyranny of PG&E’s constant gamification of my power. They keep raising and raising prices and there’s nothing attractive about putting all my eggs in the electric basket in California as long as the rates are controlled by cartels. PG&E will exploit any electric car progress for themselves and rip off their customers as hard as they can as soon as they thought th…

Long term, my plan is to buy a cheap EV like a Bolt as well as a powerwall or other home battery in a part of the world with good sunlight and build a nice little solar farm to power the house and car. Solar panels just keep getting cheaper and this plan seems increasingly like a way to nearly do away with power bills all together while still staying on grid. But until then I tend to agree, EVs aren't as appealing wh…

Yea, we’ve been discussing this as an option, especially now that there are such high quality integrated controllers and batteries. It’s become viable to do this, but it’s really rough as it kind of abandons everyone else to the meat grinder.

Re: Are US EV sales a disaster or a booming segment? The answer may be both

#58

Post by ghaff »

mook wrote: post #51
api wrote: post #29

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> All I want is an electric no-frills version of my Civic at a comparable price. The US car industry seems really determined not to allow anything affordable on the market. It's not just EVs. They also push overpriced bloated gas guzzlers. Eventually someone will get a cheap reliable decent-range EV like you want into the market and steamroll the entire industry.

Wasn't that basically why the Japanese cars got popular way back? Because they were cheaper and more efficient (and gas was getting expensive)? This time around the Japanese have been assimilated; it looks like it'll have to be the Chinese to make useful cars.

Quality was at least as important. Cheap cars that break down and rust out aren't a bargain.

Re: Are US EV sales a disaster or a booming segment? The answer may be both

#59

Post by bryanlarsen »

dalyons wrote: post #49
api wrote: post #29

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> All I want is an electric no-frills version of my Civic at a comparable price. The US car industry seems really determined not to allow anything affordable on the market. It's not just EVs. They also push overpriced bloated gas guzzlers. Eventually someone will get a cheap reliable decent-range EV like you want into the market and steamroll the entire industry.

It coming, from BYD and the other new Chinese ev companies

Not to the US. There's currently a 25% tariff on imported Chinese vehicles, and there's a proposal to raise it to 125%.
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