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Majority of workers at Mercedes plant in Alabama sign UAW authorization cards

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Re: Majority of workers at Mercedes plant in Alabama sign UAW authorization cards

#31

Post by lmm »

Swizec wrote: post #11
grecy wrote: post #6

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Because unionized workers consistently have higher pay, better benefits and more rights. Next time you see the headline about some company laying off thousands of people while simultaneously making record profits and paying their CEO some number of hundreds of millions of dollars per year, ask yourself why that never seems to happen to unionized workers. Next time you see the headline about the "working poor" that ha…

But you also hear of the people who work their butt off and can’t get promoted because union rules say promotions happen on tenure not tenure. And of unions where the ceo and union president are golf buddies and they negotiate oh so very hard to get raises that don’t even match inflation. There’s good and bad in both worlds. Ultimately the best defense you can have as a worker is to have in-demand skills and to think…

A union is like a lawyer. There are good and bad ones, and you may have to pay attention and hold their feet to the fire. But you're usually still a lot better off having one in your corner than trying to handle it yourself.

Re: Majority of workers at Mercedes plant in Alabama sign UAW authorization cards

#32

Post by nielsbot »

daniel-s wrote: post #25
xyst wrote: post #7

Good for them. Got to keep unions alive for that collective bargaining. Given the recent state court rulings in AL, I am honestly surprised Mercedes is even keeping the plant open.

I always saw unions as a bureaucratic/political layer that sits on top of workers, collecting money without contributing. I also don't think that people should all get the same pay or collectively bargain. Some people work harder, invest more in their skills, bring a better attitude, etc. They should get paid more.

This is a terrible take, and unions absolutely contribute. Just look at the concessions the UAW won from the "big 3" recently.

Unless workers band together they have no bargaining power. Without bargaining power the owners horde the profits.

Re: Majority of workers at Mercedes plant in Alabama sign UAW authorization cards

#33

Post by the_mitsuhiko »

mc32 wrote: post #17
the_mitsuhiko wrote: post #5

Earlier quoted context omitted.

How is it a trap? Seems pretty obvious for a worker to why this makes sense.

It’s good in the medium term, but in the longer term production will be moved to Mexico. No reason not to and a union of a reason to move.

It's pretty clear that this is better for the individual. Longer term they retain the option of changing the employer which is pretty much the default state. It sucks for the company but for the individual it's hard to argue that this is not a good move.

Re: Majority of workers at Mercedes plant in Alabama sign UAW authorization cards

#34

Post by throwaway0665 »

daniel-s wrote: post #25
xyst wrote: post #7

Good for them. Got to keep unions alive for that collective bargaining. Given the recent state court rulings in AL, I am honestly surprised Mercedes is even keeping the plant open.

I always saw unions as a bureaucratic/political layer that sits on top of workers, collecting money without contributing. I also don't think that people should all get the same pay or collectively bargain. Some people work harder, invest more in their skills, bring a better attitude, etc. They should get paid more.

You pay to be a part of a union so it must have some kind of value to the customers (the workers) otherwise no one would pay and there wouldn't be high union membership.

If workers felt that a good attitude and honing their skills would get them paid more than being a part of a union they wouldn't join.

Re: Majority of workers at Mercedes plant in Alabama sign UAW authorization cards

#35

Post by bugglebeetle »

daniel-s wrote: post #25
xyst wrote: post #7

Good for them. Got to keep unions alive for that collective bargaining. Given the recent state court rulings in AL, I am honestly surprised Mercedes is even keeping the plant open.

I always saw unions as a bureaucratic/political layer that sits on top of workers, collecting money without contributing. I also don't think that people should all get the same pay or collectively bargain. Some people work harder, invest more in their skills, bring a better attitude, etc. They should get paid more.

> I always saw unions as a bureaucratic/political layer that sits on top of workers, collecting money without contributing.

I think you’ve confused unions with management.

Re: Majority of workers at Mercedes plant in Alabama sign UAW authorization cards

#36

Post by defrost »

daniel-s wrote: post #25
xyst wrote: post #7

Good for them. Got to keep unions alive for that collective bargaining. Given the recent state court rulings in AL, I am honestly surprised Mercedes is even keeping the plant open.

I always saw unions as a bureaucratic/political layer that sits on top of workers, collecting money without contributing. I also don't think that people should all get the same pay or collectively bargain. Some people work harder, invest more in their skills, bring a better attitude, etc. They should get paid more.

> I always saw unions as

That's possibly a function of the unions you've directly encountered, or some personal bias of your own.

> I also don't think that people should all get the same pay

See, you already have something in common with all the unions I've ever encountered.

If somebody brings something tangibly extra to a job then they deserve a better job title and pay bracket. Unions support this- higher pay for leading hands, for skill levels, for having first aid certification, etc.

Re: Majority of workers at Mercedes plant in Alabama sign UAW authorization cards

#37

Post by cyberax »

daniel-s wrote: post #25
xyst wrote: post #7

Good for them. Got to keep unions alive for that collective bargaining. Given the recent state court rulings in AL, I am honestly surprised Mercedes is even keeping the plant open.

I always saw unions as a bureaucratic/political layer that sits on top of workers, collecting money without contributing. I also don't think that people should all get the same pay or collectively bargain. Some people work harder, invest more in their skills, bring a better attitude, etc. They should get paid more.

> I always saw unions as a bureaucratic/political layer that sits on top of workers, collecting money without contributing.

Their contribution is bargaining. Actors in Hollywood have agents for that, but if you're a worker earning an average salary, you can't afford that. So you pool your resources together for that.

> I also don't think that people should all get the same pay or collectively bargain. Some people work harder, invest more in their skills, bring a better attitude, etc. They should get paid more.

Have you ever worked in an assembly line on a plant?

Re: Majority of workers at Mercedes plant in Alabama sign UAW authorization cards

#38

Post by crooked-v »

daniel-s wrote: post #25
xyst wrote: post #7

Good for them. Got to keep unions alive for that collective bargaining. Given the recent state court rulings in AL, I am honestly surprised Mercedes is even keeping the plant open.

I always saw unions as a bureaucratic/political layer that sits on top of workers, collecting money without contributing. I also don't think that people should all get the same pay or collectively bargain. Some people work harder, invest more in their skills, bring a better attitude, etc. They should get paid more.

It's not just about pay. Collective action is the source of basic things you almost certainly take for granted, like 40-hour work weeks, workplaces with exits that aren't locked shut, and being able to protest at all without literally being gunned down by the Pinkertons.

Re: Majority of workers at Mercedes plant in Alabama sign UAW authorization cards

#39

Post by Demiurge »

daniel-s wrote: post #25
xyst wrote: post #7

Good for them. Got to keep unions alive for that collective bargaining. Given the recent state court rulings in AL, I am honestly surprised Mercedes is even keeping the plant open.

I always saw unions as a bureaucratic/political layer that sits on top of workers, collecting money without contributing. I also don't think that people should all get the same pay or collectively bargain. Some people work harder, invest more in their skills, bring a better attitude, etc. They should get paid more.

Do you also believe that monopolies are great, by any chance?

Re: Majority of workers at Mercedes plant in Alabama sign UAW authorization cards

#40

Post by ethbr1 »

daniel-s wrote: post #25
xyst wrote: post #7

Good for them. Got to keep unions alive for that collective bargaining. Given the recent state court rulings in AL, I am honestly surprised Mercedes is even keeping the plant open.

I always saw unions as a bureaucratic/political layer that sits on top of workers, collecting money without contributing. I also don't think that people should all get the same pay or collectively bargain. Some people work harder, invest more in their skills, bring a better attitude, etc. They should get paid more.

> I always saw [____] as a bureaucratic/political layer that sits on top of workers, collecting money without contributing.

Also, middle management.

I see unions as providing a necessary counterbalance to employers, who tend to have vastly more power than employees.

The fairest deals are struck between two parties with equal power.

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