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Nintendo is suing the creators of Switch emulator Yuzu

overkill.wtf

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Re: Nintendo is suing the creators of Switch emulator Yuzu

#161

Post by deelowe »

threeseed wrote: post #125
deelowe wrote: post #98

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Yuzu has amazing compatibility. I'm guessing it's getting too good for Nintendo. Their concerns with TotK are not without merit. I played it on Yuzu (on PC) because it was a much better experience than on the switch. Within a few days of the game being out, there were resolution and fps patches which made the game run much better. That said, I'm not sure how Yuzu can be blamed for TotK piracy. Guessing Nintendo is th…

> Yuzu can be blamed for TotK piracy But they can be legally blamed for not taking any steps to prevent it. Which means there are two avenues for Nintendo to attack this situation.

Hrmm. Can you explain further? What sort of inaction would make them legally liable?

Re: Nintendo is suing the creators of Switch emulator Yuzu

#162

Post by kcb »

VWWHFSfQ wrote: post #153
droopyEyelids wrote: post #127

Earlier quoted context omitted.

You forgot to mention whether you pirated the game or were playing it legally

My guess is that the number of people using Yuzu to play switch games they own is approximately 0

I use it to play my switch games at better than 640p 20-30 fps. Tranformative experience for games like Xenoblade.

Re: Nintendo is suing the creators of Switch emulator Yuzu

#163

Post by jsheard »

m-p-3 wrote: post #157
jsheard wrote: post #113

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> Nintendo has no leg to stand on legally speaking, and there's a precedent waiting to happen. IANAL, but my understanding is that while emulation is unambiguously legal in the US after Bleem vs. Sony, an emulator which decrypts games is maybe not legal under the DMCA circumvention rules, and those have never really been tested in the context of an emulator. The Bleem case happened shortly after the DMCA was enacted,…

AFAIK, the decryption keys to use the ROMs are not distributed with the emulator, and you need to retrieve these on your own from software licenses you possess.

That's correct, Yuzu doesn't include the keys, but is there any precedent that "bring your own keys" actually works as a loophole around the DMCA circumvention rules? I'm not aware of it ever being tested, so it's unclear whether it would actually hold up in a case where the softwares express purpose is to consume keys for the purpose of circumventing DRM.

Back when the movie industry was going after DVD ripping tools I don't recall anyone trying to dodge legal trouble by making the end-user supply the keys instead, so unfortunately we didn't get a decision either way back then.

Re: Nintendo is suing the creators of Switch emulator Yuzu

#164

Post by WithinReason »

andy_ppp wrote: post #154
jsheard wrote: post #104

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Amusingly Valve themselves released an official trailer for the Steam Deck which showed Yuzu installed on the homescreen. It was quickly taken down and re-posted without any references to Yuzu, probably after a panicked email from legal. https://www.pcgamer.com/valve-edits-steam-deck-trailer-to-re...

I can play Switch games on Steam Deck!?

Yes, better than on the Switch.

(now I'm awaiting legal action from Nintendo)

Re: Nintendo is suing the creators of Switch emulator Yuzu

#165

Post by skeaker »

threeseed wrote: post #125
deelowe wrote: post #98

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Yuzu has amazing compatibility. I'm guessing it's getting too good for Nintendo. Their concerns with TotK are not without merit. I played it on Yuzu (on PC) because it was a much better experience than on the switch. Within a few days of the game being out, there were resolution and fps patches which made the game run much better. That said, I'm not sure how Yuzu can be blamed for TotK piracy. Guessing Nintendo is th…

> Yuzu can be blamed for TotK piracy But they can be legally blamed for not taking any steps to prevent it. Which means there are two avenues for Nintendo to attack this situation.

Seems a bit silly. Could you sue Microsoft because they did nothing to prevent death threats from being written in Word or sent over Outlook?

Re: Nintendo is suing the creators of Switch emulator Yuzu

#166

Post by extheat »

codedokode wrote: post #95

> As a result, Nintendo ... is demanding that the Yuzu emulator is shut down. When corporations like Uber violate multiple laws, do they get shut down? When Amazon treats its employees poorly, does it get shut down? When Google forbids manufacturers to pre-install competitor apps, does it get shut down? Well, it seems that as long as copyright is not infringed, everything is ok. Also it seems to me that Nintendo migh…

Anyone can sue anyone for any reason at any time. Unless the lawsuit is in bad faith and meritless (only a court can make that determination), there is no argument to be had about "lawfare". The only difference here and in other companies is that Nintendo actually follows through with their legal threats instead of just filing complaints they don't intend to take to court.

Re: Nintendo is suing the creators of Switch emulator Yuzu

#167

Post by lmm »

GrabbinD33ze69 wrote: post #91

Correct me if I’m wrong, but wasn’t Nintendo caught using an open source emulator for the switch, without any sort of credit to the authors after suing? If so, I have no empathy for them.

> Correct me if I’m wrong, but wasn’t Nintendo caught using an open source emulator for the switch, without any sort of credit to the authors after suing?

Majesco Entertainment published some switch games made by Mistic Software, which used an open source emulator without credit and in violation of its license (and therefore were infringing copyright). Atari was somehow involved as well. Nintendo had no involvement, unless you consider them responsible for not doing a thorough enough license audit of every company that publishes Switch games or something.

Re: Nintendo is suing the creators of Switch emulator Yuzu

#168

Post by Lammy »

tavavex wrote: post #101
ndiddy wrote: post #89

Earlier quoted context omitted.

At the time Zelda leaked, it didn't work correctly in the release version of Yuzu. The lawsuit claims that the Yuzu team released a patched version that fixed the issue before the game's official retail launch date, but they have some sort of exclusivity period (looks like one week as far as I can tell) where new releases are exclusive to their Patreon before they become freely available. Nintendo is arguing that the…

I think this would be a big issue for them if they specifically marketed it as "the Zelda fix" or insinuated that the only purpose of that update was to make this leaked game playable. Otherwise, they could just say that updates address the dissimilarities between the Switch hardware and the emulator. How can Nintendo prove ill intent here?

They (publicly) blocked discussion of TOTK fixes until the game's release day, but that's still 0th hour and any build to include the fix would have been early access for whatever the ea period is: https://github.com/yuzu-emu/yuzu/issues/10226#issuecomment-1...

Prescient comment marked as off-topic: https://github.com/yuzu-emu/yuzu/pull/10234#issuecomment-154...

Re: Nintendo is suing the creators of Switch emulator Yuzu

#169

Post by Kirby64 »

garaetjjte wrote: post #141
rincebrain wrote: post #108

Earlier quoted context omitted.

That's an interesting argument, but I'm not sure it'll hold water with the judge unless they can't show such arrangements are very common with donation-funded software and was in place well before this leak, e.g. yes, we made money off this leak, but not because we designed the model to profit off people wanting to pirate/cause loss of sales, it's just how this has always worked. We'll see. I'm not really sure there'…

Ouch, releasing patch before official launch sort of proves they pirated the game themselves, which somewhat undermines defense that they don't encourage piracy.

Not necessarily. I don't know the context, but bugs/issues reported from users may have been sufficient to patch their code without touching the ROM themselves.

Re: Nintendo is suing the creators of Switch emulator Yuzu

#170

Post by justinclift »

codedokode wrote: post #95

> As a result, Nintendo ... is demanding that the Yuzu emulator is shut down. When corporations like Uber violate multiple laws, do they get shut down? When Amazon treats its employees poorly, does it get shut down? When Google forbids manufacturers to pre-install competitor apps, does it get shut down? Well, it seems that as long as copyright is not infringed, everything is ok. Also it seems to me that Nintendo migh…

Yeah, it's a pretty stark illustration of "we have enough money to fuck you up, and are very willing to do so". "Might makes right" in action.

Your monopoly point is an interesting one. Wonder if there's an actual legal case there, as Nintendo have done a lot of this bullying over the years.

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