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Selfish reasons to want more humans

rootsofprogress.org

391–400 of 480 posts

Re: Selfish reasons to want more humans

#391

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Certainly had hasn't hurt Japan's stock market. The Nikkei is at an all time high, back to the lofty heights of the 80s. Retirement in Japan is also wonderful. You should check it out.

Is it really at an all-time high? Adjusted for inflation?

Japan's inflation rate has been close to 0% since 1990

https://tradingeconomics.com/japan/inflation-cpi

Re: Selfish reasons to want more humans

#392

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I sincerely hope that in 50 years when the concern over population growth has been shown to be misguided, just as it has in the last 200 years since Malthus predicted the Earth could only support a few hundred million people, you won’t be sad and alone regretting a missed opportunity.

It seems to me that you guys inadvertently expose a kind of fundamental selfishness when you post like this. Like, it sounds as if a significant part of your reasoning on having children is the belief that you are creating a person who will be biologically obligated to like you and fulfil your emotional needs - thereby saving yourself from being sad and alone. I don't think it's common for child free people to share…

Well that’s not how I think about children, or how very many if any parents I know think about children. The entire premise of your comment is way off base.

Re: Selfish reasons to want more humans

#393
Its been fascinating reading through this thread and seeing real world examples of deccelerationism and the despair and pessimism that drives it and those calling for more people, accelerationism and the overall hope for humanity that they carry. Deccelerationism is just depression and surrender.

Re: Selfish reasons to want more humans

#394

This is an absolutely terrifying perspective. The planet can realistically support about one billion human beings. It was only the Haber–Bosch process in the early 1900s that made it possible to grow enough food to maintain the 8 billion humans we have today. At the time, it seemed like an incredible humanitarian advance, feeding so many more people than before, and providing higher profits for farmers, boosting the…

There’s a Delta flight that is flying exclusively for the pleasure of a tiny group of people who want to watch the eclipse for multiple hours https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=39447603 The concept that we’re resource constrained to the extent that we’re beyond the carrying capacity of the world is beyond ridiculous We have a greed, fear and distribution problem, not a production problem Nobody needs a Ferrari when…

What did you mean by “that’s all it takes”?

Re: Selfish reasons to want more humans

#395

Earlier quoted context omitted.

There’s a Delta flight that is flying exclusively for the pleasure of a tiny group of people who want to watch the eclipse for multiple hours https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=39447603 The concept that we’re resource constrained to the extent that we’re beyond the carrying capacity of the world is beyond ridiculous We have a greed, fear and distribution problem, not a production problem Nobody needs a Ferrari when…

There is nothing wrong with that Delta eclipse viewing flight so long as they had mandated direct air carbon capture offsets to offset the flight. The fact that they haven't is the problem, not the flight itself. Take issue with the externalities dumped elsewhere, not on the activity. If you pay the fully loaded costs, by all means, partake in your CO2 emission activity (beef, air travel, etc). Current DAC cost is ~$…

I am sure it is highly variable, but I wonder what the cost of negative soil CO2 sequestration techniques like biochar, is these days? Or even just land use improvements to sequester more CO2, seems like lower hanging fruit than DAC.

Re: Selfish reasons to want more humans

#396
post #385

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Everything in those links could have been more concisely expressed in a single sentence, short enough even to make a pithy quote, drawn from one of them: "The question of severe externalities is interesting and difficult, but let’s set it aside for the moment."

That’s completely untrue. For, example, the first of them has a lot of interesting and relevant history about how the decline of one scarce resource motivates the search for others.

If you insist we also talk about the tendentiously presentist and heavily cherry-picked historiography here on display, then I suppose we can do that. Given your apparent partiality, though, I don't know why you'd want to.

Re: Selfish reasons to want more humans

#397

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The combined population of those countries is 2.8 billion. For your assertion to be true, 71% of those countries would have had to have been in poverty in the recent past and now are not.

You got about a billion in China, they were at the bottom end of the country gdp per capita rankings, now they are well into the upper half. The commenter probably assumed India did a similar journey, but India is still full of poverty and not even close to China, so yeah probably less than two billions combined but definitely more than a billion.

The PPP adjusted value within India is 3.5 versus the dollar in the US so the per capita GDP for India is closer to $12,000 per citizen, not all that far away from chinas’s $17,000.

Re: Selfish reasons to want more humans

#398

This is an absolutely terrifying perspective. The planet can realistically support about one billion human beings. It was only the Haber–Bosch process in the early 1900s that made it possible to grow enough food to maintain the 8 billion humans we have today. At the time, it seemed like an incredible humanitarian advance, feeding so many more people than before, and providing higher profits for farmers, boosting the…

What is your source for the planet only being able to support one billion people? That's a very bold statement, given that we are currently at eight billion and have fairly clear technological pathways to sustainability. Of course sustainability is not a guaranteed outcome, it will require making good decisions, but I'm sure that a "mere" one billion people would also be unsustainable with sufficiently poor decisions…

The estimates are all over the place, but the idea is that resources are finite including space. This is one of the reasons that there is a growing trend of anti immigration even among the left. (Not my opinion since I was an immigrant.)

https://www.issuesofsustainability.org/helpndoc-content/Club...

https://theguardian.com/environment/2012/apr/26/world-popula...

https://www.bbc.com/future/article/20220905-is-the-world-ove...

Re: Selfish reasons to want more humans

#399

Earlier quoted context omitted.

It seems like you didn’t finish your response… Why is depopulation terrifying? And why shouldn’t we be concerned about resource constraints? Malthus being wrong implies nothing about the future.

Depopolating is just another word for genocid, that's why it is terrifying. Or at least should br, but then some people are just too edgy to get that.

Wouldn't most of the so-called "West" already be in the process of depopulation, based on current birthrates, if not for immigration from other regions?

Re: Selfish reasons to want more humans

#400

This is an absolutely terrifying perspective. The planet can realistically support about one billion human beings. It was only the Haber–Bosch process in the early 1900s that made it possible to grow enough food to maintain the 8 billion humans we have today. At the time, it seemed like an incredible humanitarian advance, feeding so many more people than before, and providing higher profits for farmers, boosting the…

This idea that we should depopulate is the terrifying perspective. People have been crying that the sky is falling since Malthus, and they've always been wrong. There is no "saving the planet as we know it now". The planet is ever-changing, and has never been static. There are certainly dangers to the path we're on that we have to mitigate, but depopulation is not one of the solutions.

It’s not terrifying because it has been happening since the 1950s. One theory is that as countries industrialize, their males become less fertile over subsequent generations. (This theory accounts for socioeconomic changes like abortion and being too poor to afford children.) It’s not too surprising given chemicals like BPA aka synthetic estrogen is so pervasive that now it’s in clothes and paper receipts. Almost no country is safe except for a few in central Africa

https://www.telegraph.co.uk/world-news/2022/11/25/world-popu...

https://www.theguardian.com/world/2023/jan/22/ageing-planet-...

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