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Tell HN: Equifax free credit report dark patterns

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Re: Tell HN: Equifax free credit report dark patterns

#41

Post by no_wizard »

vegetablepotpie wrote: post #27

The problem is, as you articulated, they are required by law to provide credit reporting information about you to you. They have no incentive to do this because they make their money by collecting and selling data about us. They have every reason to use this reporting requirement to collect more information about you. They have every reason to conflate credit freeze with credit hold , and confuse consumers in order t…

Here's an idea: lets burn down FICO and the credit reporting bureaus.

After all things seemed to work fine before credit scores. Perhaps we put too much "stock" in them in the first place. There has to be better ways to manage this.

One way I could forsee is a government agency that acted as a reporting depot. Then you could forbid the sale of information, and create legislative firewalls for it to keep it out of the hands of other agencies[1].

Though I will continue to argue that credit scores are deeply flawed[0].

[0]: FWIW, I have excellent credit too, so I hardly run into any real issues with it, but I have see the other side of this table. They are often used in such a way I would classify it as prejudiced discrimination with extra steps. For bigger / riskier loans. You could instead opt for point in time financial audits, for example.

[1]: Two things of note. One, last I looked into this, the government very much pulls credit reports on pull without any oversight as it sits today. Two, there is a history of legislative firewalls that do work, they need clear and strong oversight provisions, and today we have almost zero oversight of the credit bureaus. I'd roll the dice on creating something akin to the GAO or Federal Reserve type agencies (that is to say, very independent from lawmakers and presidents but still have competent oversight), but for something that functions for the intentions behind what these scores are suppose to be for.

Re: Tell HN: Equifax free credit report dark patterns

#42

Post by ziddoap »

MyFirstSass wrote: post #20
eek2121 wrote: post #4

Banks and data companies are moving to biometrics for proof of identity and you may have hit this. At least 3 credit card companies I use are signed up/using a biometrics/information provider. (they wouldn’t tell me who, despite federal disclosure requirements — I only knew they were using someone because my current accurate info was replaced by info from 7 years ago) There are companies trying very hard to find out…

Are they tracking anonymous comments or how does it work? This should be illegal in all countries.

>Are they tracking anonymous comments or how does it work?

Many people happily put their real names in their social media.

Many people put information and/or pictures which easily identifies them when combined with other data, which credit agencies have an enormous amount of (workplace, purchase of a new vehicle, house photos, school, etc.).

Those two things alone probably cover a large percent of the population.

Add in things like: using a username on social media that is the same/similar enough to the email address you signed up to credit monitoring, purchasing browser fingerprint data from whatever websites and comparing it to logged-in site visitors, etc. and the outlook is bleak.

Re: Tell HN: Equifax free credit report dark patterns

#43

Post by ziddoap »

no_wizard wrote: post #41
vegetablepotpie wrote: post #27

The problem is, as you articulated, they are required by law to provide credit reporting information about you to you. They have no incentive to do this because they make their money by collecting and selling data about us. They have every reason to use this reporting requirement to collect more information about you. They have every reason to conflate credit freeze with credit hold , and confuse consumers in order t…

Here's an idea: lets burn down FICO and the credit reporting bureaus. After all things seemed to work fine before credit scores. Perhaps we put too much "stock" in them in the first place. There has to be better ways to manage this. One way I could forsee is a government agency that acted as a reporting depot. Then you could forbid the sale of information, and create legislative firewalls for it to keep it out of the…

>lets burn down FICO and the credit reporting bureaus.

This seems to be the harder problem. I read potentially better solutions all the time, but I never read about how to get to that point first.

Re: Tell HN: Equifax free credit report dark patterns

#44

Post by no_wizard »

ziddoap wrote: post #43
no_wizard wrote: post #41

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Here's an idea: lets burn down FICO and the credit reporting bureaus. After all things seemed to work fine before credit scores. Perhaps we put too much "stock" in them in the first place. There has to be better ways to manage this. One way I could forsee is a government agency that acted as a reporting depot. Then you could forbid the sale of information, and create legislative firewalls for it to keep it out of the…

> lets burn down FICO and the credit reporting bureaus. This seems to be the harder problem. I read potentially better solutions all the time, but I never read about how to get to that point first.

Its lack of motivation really. I think people have become ingrained / numb to them that they don't really think about it until they have a problem, or some sector of society gets repeatedly screwed by the bureaus etc.

There's been no systematic callout of the bureaus in wider society, that I can tell.

Re: Tell HN: Equifax free credit report dark patterns

#45

Post by alexb_ »

no_wizard wrote: post #41
vegetablepotpie wrote: post #27

The problem is, as you articulated, they are required by law to provide credit reporting information about you to you. They have no incentive to do this because they make their money by collecting and selling data about us. They have every reason to use this reporting requirement to collect more information about you. They have every reason to conflate credit freeze with credit hold , and confuse consumers in order t…

Here's an idea: lets burn down FICO and the credit reporting bureaus. After all things seemed to work fine before credit scores. Perhaps we put too much "stock" in them in the first place. There has to be better ways to manage this. One way I could forsee is a government agency that acted as a reporting depot. Then you could forbid the sale of information, and create legislative firewalls for it to keep it out of the…

> After all things seemed to work fine before credit scores. Perhaps we put too much "stock" in them in the first place. There has to be better ways to manage this.

The old way to do it, pre-credit score, is that they would take a look at your zip code, take a look at the color of your skin, and decide if you were a "trustworthy individual"

Re: Tell HN: Equifax free credit report dark patterns

#46

Post by staplers »

MyFedora wrote: post #37
jerhewet wrote: post #25

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I actually prefer this over the other currently available options (Install our app on your phone so you can click "Accept" ... and give us access to scrape everything off of your smartphone!). I just select random questions from their list, and use the same answer for each of the questions. If they don't accept the same answer for each question, then I conclude I don't need whatever it is they're offering as badly as…

> ... and give us access to scrape everything off of your smartphone! Deny them the access? Phones are way more restricted than home computers here. App stores also reject apps that insist on permissions that are out of their scope.

  App stores also reject apps that insist on permissions that are out of their scope.
Only for smaller apps.

There are major apps that have unique integrations with app stores and consumer devices. Phone security/privacy is largely PR in this regard.

Re: Tell HN: Equifax free credit report dark patterns

#47

Post by themagician »

dylan604 wrote: post #12

> confirmed identity by asking knowledge based questions I'm not sure I feel good about this either. Isn't your mother's maiden name, the street you grew up on, your first concert, or your pet's name all information that is pretty much well known by now. Primarily by you (royal) for taking those stupid social media quizzes.

The funniest part about these is that if someone has stolen your identity and successfully gotten things added to your credit report then you may actually FAIL to answer correctly questions about yourself.

Re: Tell HN: Equifax free credit report dark patterns

#48

Post by delfinom »

eek2121 wrote: post #4

Banks and data companies are moving to biometrics for proof of identity and you may have hit this. At least 3 credit card companies I use are signed up/using a biometrics/information provider. (they wouldn’t tell me who, despite federal disclosure requirements — I only knew they were using someone because my current accurate info was replaced by info from 7 years ago) There are companies trying very hard to find out…

Thank god NYS made it illegal for employers to query your existing payroll data from the databrokers awhile back.

But unfortunately every single major payroll provider (like ADP) in the US now shares your payroll data with Equifax and more. And those services openly advertise for employers to use them to be able to beat down new employees on salaries among other things.

Re: Tell HN: Equifax free credit report dark patterns

#49

Post by lazide »

alexb_ wrote: post #45
no_wizard wrote: post #41

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Here's an idea: lets burn down FICO and the credit reporting bureaus. After all things seemed to work fine before credit scores. Perhaps we put too much "stock" in them in the first place. There has to be better ways to manage this. One way I could forsee is a government agency that acted as a reporting depot. Then you could forbid the sale of information, and create legislative firewalls for it to keep it out of the…

> After all things seemed to work fine before credit scores. Perhaps we put too much "stock" in them in the first place. There has to be better ways to manage this. The old way to do it, pre-credit score, is that they would take a look at your zip code, take a look at the color of your skin, and decide if you were a "trustworthy individual"

Now now, don’t be nasty.

They’d also look at the quality of your suit, or lack thereof, your accent, and try to guess your religion.

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