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Google to pause Gemini image generation of people after issues

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Re: Google to pause Gemini image generation of people after issues

#541

Post by trallnag »

xanderlewis wrote: post #239
solumunus wrote: post #143

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I’m in the UK and there’s predominantly white people showing on the page.

That’s because almost all of this is a distinctly American obsession and problem. Unfortunately it’s gleefully been exported worldwide into contexts where it doesn’t immediately — if at all — apply over the last five years or so and now we’re all saddled with this slow-growing infection. Entire careers are built on the sort of thing that led Google to this place, and they’re not gonna give up easily.

Nah, it's not just the US. Ever heard of the BBC? They are from Britain.

Re: Google to pause Gemini image generation of people after issues

#542

Post by dustedcodes »

empath-nirvana wrote: post #387
34679 wrote: post #277

Here's the problem for Google: Gemini pukes out a perfect visual representation of actual systemic racism that pervades throughout modern corporate culture in the US. Daily interactions can be masked by platitudes and dog whistles. A poster of non-white celtic warriors cannot. Gemini refused to create an image of "a nice white man", saying it was "too spicy", but had no problem when asked for an image of "a nice blac…

There is an _actual problem_ that needs to be solved. If you ask generative AI for a picture of a "nurse", it will produce a picture of a white woman 100% of the time, without some additional prompting or fine tuning that encourages it to do something else. If you ask a generative AI for a picture of a "software engineer", it will produce a picture of a white guy 100% of the time, without some additional prompting or…

> If you ask generative AI for a picture of a "nurse", it will produce a picture of a white woman 100% of the time

I actually don't think that is true, but your entire comment is a lot of waffle which completely glances over the real issue here:

If I ask it to generate an image of a white nurse I don't want to be told that it cannot be done because it is racist, but when I ask to generate an image of a black nurse it happily complies with my request. That is just absolutely dumb gutter racism purposefully programmed into the AI by people who simply hate Caucasian people. Like WTF, I will never trust Google anymore, no matter how they try to u-turn from this I am appalled by Gemini and will never spend a single penny on any AI product made by Google.

Re: Google to pause Gemini image generation of people after issues

#543

Post by fdsfdsafdsafds »

stcroixx wrote: post #510
jack_riminton wrote: post #317

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Reminds me of when black people in the UK get called African American by Americans. No they're neither African nor American It's an incredibly self-centered view of the world

What is the preferred term in the UK - African British?

If you started calling British black people "African", it wouldn't be long before you got a punch.

Re: Google to pause Gemini image generation of people after issues

#544

Post by aliasxneo »

Quite the cultural flame war in this thread. For me, the whole incident points to the critical importance of open models. A bit of speculation, but if AI is eventually intended to play a role in education, this sort of control would be a dream for historical revisionists. The classic battle of the thought police is now being extended to AI.

Re: Google to pause Gemini image generation of people after issues

#545

Post by trallnag »

FrozenSynapse wrote: post #111
tycho-newman wrote: post #89

Earlier quoted context omitted.

We have tons of viking material culture you can access directly without the AI layer. AI as learning tool here feels misplaced to me.

what's the point of image generators then? what if i want to put vikings in a certain setting, in a certain artistic style?

Than put that into the prompt explicitly instead of relying on Google, OpenAI, or whatever to add "racially ambiguous"

Re: Google to pause Gemini image generation of people after issues

#546

Post by electrondood »

mhuffman wrote: post #455
rosmax_1337 wrote: post #418

Why does google dislike white people? What does this have to do with corporate greed? (which you could always assume when a company does something bad)

>Why does google dislike white people? Because it is currently in fashion to do so. >What does this have to do with corporate greed? It has to do with a lot of things, but specifically greed-related the very fastest way to lose money or damage your brand is to offend someone that has access to large social reach. So better for them to err on the side of safety.

This is a straw man.

It's recognizing and mitigating systemic bias, where there is currently a massive bias for whiteness, maleness, heterosexuality, etc.

Consider that 65% of the US population is not white and male, yet something like 85% of the leading characters in all media are... white and male.

If you're going to argue that systemic bias does not exist, and that it's some kind of trendy passing fad to pretend that it does, you're not going to get very far before you're confronted with the statistical reality.

Re: Google to pause Gemini image generation of people after issues

#547

Post by Jerrrry »

rondini wrote: post #454
34679 wrote: post #277

Here's the problem for Google: Gemini pukes out a perfect visual representation of actual systemic racism that pervades throughout modern corporate culture in the US. Daily interactions can be masked by platitudes and dog whistles. A poster of non-white celtic warriors cannot. Gemini refused to create an image of "a nice white man", saying it was "too spicy", but had no problem when asked for an image of "a nice blac…

Are you seriously claiming that the actual systemic racism in our society is discrimination against white people? I just struggle to imagine someone holding this belief in good faith.

>I just struggle to imagine someone holding this belief in good faith.

If you struggle with the most basic tenant of this website, and the most basic tenants of the human condition:

maybe you are the issue.

Re: Google to pause Gemini image generation of people after issues

#548

Post by lelanthran »

empath-nirvana wrote: post #387
34679 wrote: post #277

Here's the problem for Google: Gemini pukes out a perfect visual representation of actual systemic racism that pervades throughout modern corporate culture in the US. Daily interactions can be masked by platitudes and dog whistles. A poster of non-white celtic warriors cannot. Gemini refused to create an image of "a nice white man", saying it was "too spicy", but had no problem when asked for an image of "a nice blac…

There is an _actual problem_ that needs to be solved. If you ask generative AI for a picture of a "nurse", it will produce a picture of a white woman 100% of the time, without some additional prompting or fine tuning that encourages it to do something else. If you ask a generative AI for a picture of a "software engineer", it will produce a picture of a white guy 100% of the time, without some additional prompting or…

> even assuming that it's just because most nurses are women and most software engineers are white guys, that doesn't mean that it should be the only thing it ever produces, because that also wouldn't reflect reality

What makes you think that that's the "only" thing it produces?

If you reach into a bowl with 98 red balls and 2 blue balls, you can't complain that you get red balls 98% of the time.

Re: Google to pause Gemini image generation of people after issues

#549

Post by [deleted] »

empath-nirvana wrote: post #387
34679 wrote: post #277

Here's the problem for Google: Gemini pukes out a perfect visual representation of actual systemic racism that pervades throughout modern corporate culture in the US. Daily interactions can be masked by platitudes and dog whistles. A poster of non-white celtic warriors cannot. Gemini refused to create an image of "a nice white man", saying it was "too spicy", but had no problem when asked for an image of "a nice blac…

There is an _actual problem_ that needs to be solved. If you ask generative AI for a picture of a "nurse", it will produce a picture of a white woman 100% of the time, without some additional prompting or fine tuning that encourages it to do something else. If you ask a generative AI for a picture of a "software engineer", it will produce a picture of a white guy 100% of the time, without some additional prompting or…

[deleted]

Re: Google to pause Gemini image generation of people after issues

#550

Post by Workaccount2 »

Eduard wrote: post #54

seems like as if Gemini was trained excessively on Google PR and marketing material. Case in point: https://store.google.com/

Recently they have been better, but since I noticed this a number of years ago, google is extremely adverse to putting white people and especially white males in their marketing - unless it is a snippet with someone internal. Then it's pretty often a white male.

To be clear, I don't think that this would even be that bad. But when you look at the demographics of people who use pixel phones, it's like google is using grandpas in the marketing material for graphics cards.

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