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Mozilla Firefox is below PG&E threshold for support

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Re: Mozilla Firefox is below PG&E threshold for support

#51

Post by pengaru »

mistrial9 wrote: post #44
pengaru wrote: post #39

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> I've lived all over the US. Why are utility company websites SO BAD? All of them are terrible. Utility companies are deliberately regional monopolies, without the threat of competition there's no incentive to do better. That's presumably reflected in but not limited to the quality of their web sites.

In California, PG&E refused to hand over legally-required documents, in addition to refusing to hand over ordinary information that they were not required to hand over. Subsequently, a pipeline in San Bruno ( updt ) area exploded, a dozen houses burned to the ground, and several people died. They established new legal precedent by being convicted of Murder One. investigations subsequently determined that PG&E had fal…

> Subsequently, a pipeline in San Mateo area exploded, a dozen houses burned to the ground, and several people died.

I recall the San Bruno gas explosion[0] you're referring to. It happened at a time when I regularly drove down that leg of Skyline to access Pacifica and Ocean Beach coming from south bay via the peninsula/280.

We clearly need better solutions for how such utilities are delivered and their businesses operated. Though in the case of residential gas lines, we should probably just stop the practice, especially in seismically active regions like the bay area...

[0] https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/San_Bruno_pipeline_explosion

[00] https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=tNSjRKY7Ha8

Re: Mozilla Firefox is below PG&E threshold for support

#52

Post by bryanlarsen »

mfer wrote: post #37

Consider what support mean. It doesn't mean "works with". Supported likely means that they test with and design for. It also means that if a customer is using that browser and there's a problem (e.g., seeing their bill online) they will fix the problem if it's just in that browser. Firefox is 3.3% of users [1]. When it comes to testing features with (including QA validation) and working around browser specific bugs,…

Is that a tracker that works even in the presence of AdBlock et al? If not, it's going to significantly undercount Firefox.

Re: Mozilla Firefox is below PG&E threshold for support

#53

Post by mcint »

mfer wrote: post #37

Consider what support mean. It doesn't mean "works with". Supported likely means that they test with and design for. It also means that if a customer is using that browser and there's a problem (e.g., seeing their bill online) they will fix the problem if it's just in that browser. Firefox is 3.3% of users [1]. When it comes to testing features with (including QA validation) and working around browser specific bugs,…

Well summarized. It's amusing to read Brave on their unsupported list, since it's just Chromium with privacy features built-in. They wouldn't be able to tell, non-invasively, since it self-reports as the most boring, common version of Chrome that it can. Actually, privacy features that break sites by default if you don't know how to adjust them. Works, guaranteed by our developers and customer support folks, should be a different bar.

So long as they don't active sniff and reject non-approved browsers.

Re: Mozilla Firefox is below PG&E threshold for support

#54

Post by mistrial9 »

porphyra wrote: post #35
racl101 wrote: post #19

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Yeah, I was wondering about this. Who the heck is PG&E and why is it newsworthy if a single company doesn't support Firefox browser fully?

It's a electricity and gas utility that serves San Francisco and the Bay Area. Many Hacker News readers are from this area. People love complaining about PG&E since its prices are ludicrously high (one of the highest in the nation --- about 50 cents per kWh), while the service is quite poor (they famously caused some serious wildfires and have frequent power outages during storms, although admittedly the recent coupl…

close, but think bigger

Fast facts about PG&E The company provides natural gas and electric service to approximately 16 million people throughout a 70,000-square-mile service area in northern and central California.

Re: Mozilla Firefox is below PG&E threshold for support

#55

Post by unethical_ban »

anotherhue wrote: post #49
unethical_ban wrote: post #13

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Do not post inflammatory comments without elaboration or context. Your comment should not be a puzzle that the reader should have to solve.

If that comment is inflammatory for you then I suggest you recalibrate.

Edit

Why respond to this and not the other people asking what you're talking about?

My point is your post is highly opinionated, tangential to the posted topic (without explanation) and needlessly without context.

It would have been quite easy to say

"I think paying $6.5M in management last year[0] was actively harmful to Firefox's market position

[0] source"

One need not be a chronic HN comment reader to understand this version.

Re: Mozilla Firefox is below PG&E threshold for support

#56

Post by gtk40 »

bryanlarsen wrote: post #52
mfer wrote: post #37

Consider what support mean. It doesn't mean "works with". Supported likely means that they test with and design for. It also means that if a customer is using that browser and there's a problem (e.g., seeing their bill online) they will fix the problem if it's just in that browser. Firefox is 3.3% of users [1]. When it comes to testing features with (including QA validation) and working around browser specific bugs,…

Is that a tracker that works even in the presence of AdBlock et al? If not, it's going to significantly undercount Firefox.

I have a theory that Firefox gets under reported in a lot of stats because its users are more likely to use Adblockers. Statcounter for example is going to be blocked by most Adblockers; stats based on server logs will be more accurate.

Re: Mozilla Firefox is below PG&E threshold for support

#57

Post by bryanlarsen »

gtk40 wrote: post #56
bryanlarsen wrote: post #52

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Is that a tracker that works even in the presence of AdBlock et al? If not, it's going to significantly undercount Firefox.

I have a theory that Firefox gets under reported in a lot of stats because its users are more likely to use Adblockers. Statcounter for example is going to be blocked by most Adblockers; stats based on server logs will be more accurate.

It's not just client side trackers that get blocked -- any server side tracker that only counts specific resources being requested is going to be blocked by Adblockers too.

Re: Mozilla Firefox is below PG&E threshold for support

#58

Post by quectophoton »

weaksauce wrote: post #16
bandergirl wrote: post #5

Earlier quoted context omitted.

“Support” means “actively testing and fixing bugs” This news doesn’t mean that it just will stop working in Firefox, it’s just that they don’t test and they don’t care.

i have seen websites that actively block you from using them unless you’re on a “supported” browser. it’s kinda nuts

Example: Twitch still doesn't let me login from Firefox if I'm on Alpine Linux.

It only happens when I try from Alpine Linux, so they might be testing for some musl-specific quirk and denying access just for not being the Firefox from a different distro.

Re: Mozilla Firefox is below PG&E threshold for support

#59

Post by jonathankoren »

mozempthrowaway wrote: post #24
jonathankoren wrote: post #8

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Once more for the people in the back. clap The clap Foundation clap Is clap Not clap The clap Corporation clap

You don’t understand how it works either. Mitchell is both the chair of the foundation and until like 2 weeks ago was the CEO. She had full control over where the money goes hence why she increased her pay so much. The foundation is sole owner of the corporation.

Please don’t explain the structure of Mozilla to a former Mozillian.

Re: Mozilla Firefox is below PG&E threshold for support

#60

Post by mozempthrowaway »

nozzlegear wrote: post #47
mozempthrowaway wrote: post #18

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I think it’s a reminder of what Mitchell’s priorities were as CEO: lining her pockets and funneling money to her political projects. She has deep ties at Google and after getting out of the Yahoo deal when Verizon bought them, she got a sweetheart deal from Google that was an 84% increase of revenue YoY. She then laid off 25% of the company that year. This last year she ran a budget surplus as she failed to hire as a…

Has she said anywhere that those were her priorities, or is that just conjecture? People on HN seem to forget that she was the CEO of Mozilla, not Firefox LLC, and Mozilla’s goals have long been broader than just providing life support to a browser that continues to grow more irrelevant every year.

I work at Mozilla, there is no Firefox LLC. Please don’t post stuff like this if you’re unfamiliar with the corporate structure.

There is Mozilla Corporation a for profit entity that is responsible for virtually all development of products under the Mozilla name. Then there is Mozilla Foundation, a non-profit that is the sole owner of Mozilla Corporation. Mitchell until stepping down as CEO a few weeks ago was both the chair of the foundation and the CEO of the corporation.

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