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The happiest kids in the world have social safety nets

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Re: The happiest kids in the world have social safety nets

#11

Post by dopamean »

MBlume wrote: post #4

I'm strongly in favor of expanding the US social safety net, but I don't want to neglect other obvious factors here. Dutch children are able to walk or bike outside unsupervised. In the US they'd risk either being killed by a driver, or stopped by an overzealous neighbor or police officer. I think this kind of freedom of movement has a big effect on happiness, it certainly did for me. ETA relevant links: https://yout…

I read a blog post a while back that had the idea that the reason so many American's remember their college years so fondly is because for many of them it was the only time in their lives where they lived somewhere walkable.

Re: The happiest kids in the world have social safety nets

#12

Post by Verdex »

MBlume wrote: post #4

I'm strongly in favor of expanding the US social safety net, but I don't want to neglect other obvious factors here. Dutch children are able to walk or bike outside unsupervised. In the US they'd risk either being killed by a driver, or stopped by an overzealous neighbor or police officer. I think this kind of freedom of movement has a big effect on happiness, it certainly did for me. ETA relevant links: https://yout…

Yeah, the way I see it, as a parent I've got basically two responsibilities for my children. Ensure safety and wellbeing AND facilitate increased autonomy as their development allows.

I'm more than happy to transition into a secondary caregiver for their own children and/or a financial backstop when they get to that stage of life. But I've met too many people first hand who were never allowed to increase their own autonomy as they aged into adulthood. Sometimes due to their parents and sometimes due to society. They do not seem to be happy.

Re: The happiest kids in the world have social safety nets

#13

Post by username135 »

jdmoreira wrote: post #8

> American parents on both sides of the political spectrum know this and are increasingly frustrated by how little they have been offered in this country—particularly in exchange for the high taxes they pay. How much taxes do Americans think we Europeans pay? Those dutch parents are paying close to 60-70% taxes once you account also for VAT

Source that please

Re: The happiest kids in the world have social safety nets

#14

Post by nicoco »

sebastianconcpt wrote: post #3

And the most successful ones?

Do you mean money-wise? What's the point if you're not happy?

The only thing I want for my kids besides them being happy, is that their happiness does not depend on the misery of other human beings. Funnily enough, "success" is often used as a synonym for "being a sociopath born with a silver spoon who does not give a damn about not making others miserable".

Re: The happiest kids in the world have social safety nets

#15

Post by JohnFen »

MBlume wrote: post #4

I'm strongly in favor of expanding the US social safety net, but I don't want to neglect other obvious factors here. Dutch children are able to walk or bike outside unsupervised. In the US they'd risk either being killed by a driver, or stopped by an overzealous neighbor or police officer. I think this kind of freedom of movement has a big effect on happiness, it certainly did for me. ETA relevant links: https://yout…

> In the US they'd risk either being killed by a driver, or stopped by an overzealous neighbor or police officer.

It may depends on where in the US you're talking about, but in my area none of this is actually true. Although lots of people believe it is.

Re: The happiest kids in the world have social safety nets

#16

Post by hackinthebochs »

I started the article expecting it to be little more than a standard case of one's pet grievance being the cause of all of society's ills. I was pleasantly surprised as I started reading. I thought maybe 'social safety net' to the author doesn't mean wealth distribution but rather something like community engagement and mutual support. Alas. Not halfway through does the article take the expected turn towards pet grievance.

Not that wealth disparities aren't a serious issue; the issues mentioned for poor parents raising children are certainly real. They just don't strike me as the reason Americans don't parent in a laissez-faire manner. The reasons are more to do with lack of community engagement, lack of trust, misplaced fear of harm, an endless optimizing mindset, and so on. Wealth disparity doesn't even register.

Re: The happiest kids in the world have social safety nets

#17

Post by jeffbee »

jdmoreira wrote: post #8

> American parents on both sides of the political spectrum know this and are increasingly frustrated by how little they have been offered in this country—particularly in exchange for the high taxes they pay. How much taxes do Americans think we Europeans pay? Those dutch parents are paying close to 60-70% taxes once you account also for VAT

You must have assumed some level of income. How much?

Re: The happiest kids in the world have social safety nets

#18

Post by MBlume »

dopamean wrote: post #11
MBlume wrote: post #4

I'm strongly in favor of expanding the US social safety net, but I don't want to neglect other obvious factors here. Dutch children are able to walk or bike outside unsupervised. In the US they'd risk either being killed by a driver, or stopped by an overzealous neighbor or police officer. I think this kind of freedom of movement has a big effect on happiness, it certainly did for me. ETA relevant links: https://yout…

I read a blog post a while back that had the idea that the reason so many American's remember their college years so fondly is because for many of them it was the only time in their lives where they lived somewhere walkable.

This was my experience. There's this narrative that you move away from your parents and you have the freedom and independence they were previously denying you, and I'm sure that's very much the case for many people but it's not as though my parents were ever trying to keep me from going places and seeing people, the built environment where I grew up (suburb of Los Angeles) did that.

Re: The happiest kids in the world have social safety nets

#19

Post by Lance_ET_Compte »

softwaredoug wrote: post #10
MBlume wrote: post #4

I'm strongly in favor of expanding the US social safety net, but I don't want to neglect other obvious factors here. Dutch children are able to walk or bike outside unsupervised. In the US they'd risk either being killed by a driver, or stopped by an overzealous neighbor or police officer. I think this kind of freedom of movement has a big effect on happiness, it certainly did for me. ETA relevant links: https://yout…

Cars ruin cities - https://www.ft.com/content/27169841-7ee3-481e-919d-41b247e40...

[flagged]

Re: The happiest kids in the world have social safety nets

#20

Post by NoMoreNicksLeft »

I'm somewhat skeptical that the Dutch social safety net is why Dutch parents let their kids "ride their bikes in the rain unsupervised".

Does anyone believe that Americans would be more like Dutch parents with a social safety net? What causal chain is necessary for that result, when American parents tend to be be like that due to anxiety about monstrous crimes? Do we really believe that the crimes happen enough that the anxiety is warranted, but when welfare starts taking care of the underclass, there will somehow be fewer kiddy diddlers? Do we believe the anxiety is unwarranted, but when the parents' unemployment insurance is more robust that they'll realize that such dangers are so statistically unlikely that they won't worry until the kid hasn't checked in for 3 straight nights?

Is there some evidence that these hypotheses might be true? Am I missing something?

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