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The Empire Strikes Back First Draft by Leigh Brackett (1978) [pdf]

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Re: The Empire Strikes Back First Draft by Leigh Brackett (1978) [pdf]

#51

Post by binary132 »

pests wrote: post #34
dudinax wrote: post #14

Earlier quoted context omitted.

This script is good evidence they made up the connection part way through Empire. Also, if Lucas already had it in mind for Star Wars, I doubt he'd have Obiwan straight up lie about it.

I don't even consider it a straight up lie. I know we have decades of this built into our culture, and its been basically ret-conned, but... "A young Jedi named Darth Vader, who was a pupil of mine until he turned to evil, helped the Empire hunt down and destroy the Jedi Knights. He betrayed and murdered your father" I could still see Ben making this metaphor for the internal struggle Anakin dealt with, not wanting t…

I always assumed it was written this way on purpose and thought it was a cool moment. Oh well.

Re: The Empire Strikes Back First Draft by Leigh Brackett (1978) [pdf]

#52

Post by kevingadd »

saghm wrote: post #6
PotatoPancakes wrote: post #4

Look on page 117 of the PDF (the paper says 113): > Vader: You're very good, Luke. But I'm twenty years older and stronger than you in the use of the Force. You haven't a chance with me... any more than your father had. This draft was written before they came up with the idea that Vader could actually be Luke's father!

Honestly, what strikes me about this line isn't even that Vader isn't Luke's father, but how wordy he is. I imagine they didn't spend too much time on phrasing and instead just tried to capture the gist with the expectation of polishing later, but even with the James Earl Jones's trademark slow, menacing Vader drawl, this just feels like it would sound weirdly verbose coming from Vader, especially in the middle of a…

As a writer it's not uncommon to have a separate person (sometimes an editor) trim down/punch up dialogue. Dialogue writing is basically a separate skill from prose or screenplay writing, though the best writers are good at it too.

Re: The Empire Strikes Back First Draft by Leigh Brackett (1978) [pdf]

#53

Post by jjulius »

ethbr1 wrote: post #28
jjulius wrote: post #23

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Wow. So, "stringing people along = murderable offense". Got it.

You don't see some justice in a serial con man being stabbed by someone he conned? I guess we have different morals with respect to the acceptability of lying.

There's "a serial con man getting justice" (nods head) and "a serial con man getting justice" (shakes head).

Now, had this been about someone being conned out of a shitload of money, sure, maybe I can begin to understand the stabbing. But at this point, the only thing we know is that this person told a ton of tall tales - that's absolutely not worth being killed over.

Re: The Empire Strikes Back First Draft by Leigh Brackett (1978) [pdf]

#55

Post by xdavidliu »

jmann99999 wrote: post #42

If you like things like this, you might also like The "Making of Star Wars" books by J.W. Rinzler [0]. They provide a view of how the story was made, the people who made it, and many interesting facts. [0] https://www.amazon.com/Making-Star-Wars-Definitive-Original/...

back in 1993, I had just immigrated from China to State College, PA, and was just starting to eat cereal for the first time in my life. One of the offers on cereal boxes back then was a "making of star wars" VHS tape, which I collected barcodes and received by mail order. Of course, that video is currently on youtube

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=FSuDjjlIPak

Re: The Empire Strikes Back First Draft by Leigh Brackett (1978) [pdf]

#56

Post by canjobear »

hgs3 wrote: post #48
ethbr1 wrote: post #26

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Wow. So basically, if one line of dialog in A New Hope had been less ambiguous as it happened to be written... Vader wouldn't have been Anakin?

I'd say the original already isn't ambiguous: Kenobi directly tells Luke that Vader murdered his Father. The "from a certain point of view" scene had to be added in ROTJ to explain away the retcon.

Ben Kenobi does pause in a pregnant way right before delivering the fateful line. In a way that almost looks like he's thinking about how to hide something. It works perfectly with the later revelation.

Re: The Empire Strikes Back First Draft by Leigh Brackett (1978) [pdf]

#57

Post by greedo »

stevep98 wrote: post #47
dudinax wrote: post #14

Earlier quoted context omitted.

This script is good evidence they made up the connection part way through Empire. Also, if Lucas already had it in mind for Star Wars, I doubt he'd have Obiwan straight up lie about it.

But the "I am your father" wasn't in the shooting script anyway. The script said "Obi-Wan killed your father", and it was changed to "I am your father when James Earl Jones" said the line for the voice of Vader. Maybe it is that way in subsequent published scripts but not the original.

They didn't trust David Prowse, so the lines were altered in the shooting script. JEJ then recorded the actual lines.

Re: The Empire Strikes Back First Draft by Leigh Brackett (1978) [pdf]

#58

Post by ethbr1 »

jjulius wrote: post #53
ethbr1 wrote: post #28

Earlier quoted context omitted.

You don't see some justice in a serial con man being stabbed by someone he conned? I guess we have different morals with respect to the acceptability of lying.

There's "a serial con man getting justice" (nods head) and "a serial con man getting justice" (shakes head). Now, had this been about someone being conned out of a shitload of money, sure, maybe I can begin to understand the stabbing. But at this point, the only thing we know is that this person told a ton of tall tales - that's absolutely not worth being killed over.

>> For example, he had plenty of 35mm trailers to sell...

>> ... he claimed to have a script of, as I recall, the not-yet-released sequel to Star Wars. I think he wanted $25 or so for a copy of it.

>> ... someone he had lead along with a whole string of lies like claiming he knew George Lucas and how he could pass along the kid's story ideas to him — things like that. The kid finally figured out he was being had and snapped.

I took the above to indicate that he wasn't only telling tall tails, but that he was repeatedly profiting from them.

Re: The Empire Strikes Back First Draft by Leigh Brackett (1978) [pdf]

#59

Post by detourdog »

nyrath wrote: post #30
caslon wrote: post #8

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Much of what you actually see in Empire is written by entirely different people. > George Lucas initially hired Leigh Brackett, the sci-fi novelist who also wrote screenplays for Howard Hawks—including The Big Sleep (1946)—to write the sequel to Star Wars (1977). Brackett died in March 1978 while the film was still in pre-production, though, and Lucas wasn't satisfied with her script. Lucas wrote the next draft himse…

Leigh Brackett also wrote the screenplays for The Big Sleep (1946), Rio Bravo (1959), and The Long Goodbye (1973)

The Big Sleep has the reputation for making no sense/convoluted plot. I enjoy it.
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