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Russian troops use Starlink licensed and imported from Dubai

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Re: Russian troops use Starlink licensed and imported from Dubai

#271

Post by geraldhh »

_heimdall wrote: post #236
geraldhh wrote: post #155

Earlier quoted context omitted.

starlink meta data is surely being collected and used for sigint, thou i suspect russia has good enough mathematicians so that listening in on content is not on the table unless the endpoints are compromised.

I never know where the line is for assumptions on encryption and espionage. The Germans thought Enigma was unbreakable, you really just never know if you encryption was compromised unless the ones who cracked it tip their cards.

tbf enigma was marketed as unbreakable, but serious engineers know that such a "perfect" thing is very unlikely to be true.

also afaik it did hold up until a sizeable amount of corelated plain-chipher-text was available for analysis.

Re: Russian troops use Starlink licensed and imported from Dubai

#272

Post by infecto »

skotobaza wrote: post #223
infecto wrote: post #116

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I have never seen Russian being describe as the ultimate boogeyman while in America but I am also realistic. Russia is after all a mob run state and makes no qualms with public assassinations. There are fairly well documented instances of their operations. I am not scared of them, look at the massive failure their military is but I also am aware that they are an outlier to world stability.

> makes no qualms with public assassinations Unlike US?

Sure? No doubt the US does similar activities and in the past more so when it comes to creating instability within regions but in more recent history I don’t think we have made very public executions on foreign soil, even more so I cannot recall us doing it in public for dissidents.

Re: Russian troops use Starlink licensed and imported from Dubai

#273

Post by justsomehnguy »

skissane wrote: post #245
justsomehnguy wrote: post #189

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Ehm. You need a precise clock for any form of GNSS[0] to function. AFAIR StarLink satellites doesn't have precise clock on the board. And anyway, modern GNSS chips are.. $1? Cheaper? No way you wouldn't use GNSS already deployed and working (and you are not paying for it) in a commercial product. [0] GPS is GNSS, it's just in America GPS became the synonym for GNSS

> You need a precise clock for any form of GNSS[0] to function How precise? I assume that inaccuracy in the clock produces imprecision in location - how much time inaccuracy produces how much location inaccuracy? > And anyway, modern GNSS chips are.. $1? Cheaper? No way you wouldn't use GNSS already deployed and working (and you are not paying for it) in a commercial product. Rather than using the Starlink satellites…

> How precise

GNSS satellites orbits are between 20000km and 30000km. 20kkm is 0.06671s of c, 30kkm is 0.10007s, 5km is 0.000016678. So a very precise, that's why they have an atomic clock on board instead of cheap quartz one.

> if the two differ by 50,000 metres, you know something is going wrong

Like what your imprecise methods give you a very rough estimate where is the terminal and your legitimate customers in the nearby areas (not even doing anything for or against) are saying thanks for their shut off terminals.

https://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/b/b4/Comparis...

https://www.omnicalculator.com/physics/light-year

Re: Russian troops use Starlink licensed and imported from Dubai

#274

Post by somenameforme »

mopsi wrote: post #266
somenameforme wrote: post #260

Earlier quoted context omitted.

"On 19 June 2018, the Russian State Duma adopted a bill that made education in all languages but Russian optional, overruling previous laws by ethnic autonomies, and reducing instruction in minority languages to only two hours a week.[48][49][50] This bill has been likened by some commentators, such as in Foreign Affairs, to the policy of Russification.[48]" This is not really what I would call ethnic strife. I do ag…

> such a law obviously does not prevent people from using or learning their ethnic language It is only one measure of many that is driving the rapid decline of indigenous peoples in Russia. Russia has a long history of methodical persecution of indigenous peoples with a wide arsenal that spans from closure of schools and suppression of media to made up charges about "extremism" and being a "foreign agent" to punitive…

My friend, what you're doing here is called gish galloping. [1] Pick something you find truly compelling and stick with it. A lot of the things you're saying are poorly supported, misleading, or probably plainly false. And FWIW I'm not saying you're doing this intentionally. "We" have been in an information warfare mode for the past 2 years, and the truth is only just recently starting to come out of this mess. We probably won't really know what's happened over the past 2 years for many years yet to come.

So for example, I decided to look up the European Convention on Human Rights things, because it sounded pretty interesting. And what you've been told is not quite what happened. It seems that after the invasion of Ukraine, the relevant bureaucracy chose to suspend Russia's representation in such, so Russia announced a petition to withdraw from the organization, which the Council responded with, 'you can't quit, you're fired!' type stuff. [2]

It's just the ongoing of weaponization of international organizations in the West, which ultimately serves little purpose other than to undermine their relevance and authority. Observe the the grossly incongruent responses to actions of Israel vs those of Russia. Organizations whose actions become driven by politics become seen as political actors, which entirely defeats their purpose.

---

[1] - https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Gish_gallop

[2] - https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Member_states_of_the_Council_o...

Re: Russian troops use Starlink licensed and imported from Dubai

#275

Post by justsomehnguy »

_heimdall wrote: post #213
justsomehnguy wrote: post #208

Earlier quoted context omitted.

>US plausible deniability *snort*

It never really has to be believable, it just needs to be enough that you can deny direct involvement in a specific attack. I have little patience for politics and which we didn't let pur world be run this way, but that's the way we do it.

So the usual 'it's okay when USA does that, totally not okay when someone else does that'.

Re: Russian troops use Starlink licensed and imported from Dubai

#276

Post by baybal2 »

vardump wrote: post #54
swores wrote: post #42

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Forgive me if I'm thinking like a TV writer since I don't have the scientific knowledge, hence the question: can GPS signals not be spoofed, if you are in possession of the device you want to trick? I.e. Couldn't they have fake GPS signals right next to a Starlink terminal that's not strong enough to have a wide-reaching effect, but enough for the terminal to believe it's somewhere it isn't and report that false loca…

Spoofing a Starlink receiver's GPS is not going to be very helpful with phase-shifted array antennas. Both the satellite and the terminal need to know each other's position. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Phased_array

[dead]

Re: Russian troops use Starlink licensed and imported from Dubai

#277

Post by khzw8yyy »

lispm wrote: post #269
khzw8yyy wrote: post #267

Earlier quoted context omitted.

This one was actually heard by a sizable audience? The Western take is: look, Putin is avoiding talking about the current conflict and talks history instead. The Russian take is: look, Crimea changes hands once every 100 or so years, and this is just the latest iteration.

> This one was actually heard by a sizable audience? So, the content is the same? An aggressor trying to justify his aggression by his version of history? > The Russian take is: look, Crimea changes hands once every 100 or so years, and this is just the latest iteration. Putin was not going after Crimea, he was going to "free" the whole Ukraine in a few days (the "special operation") and then beyond. That's what he s…

Come on, you don't actually believe in "and beyond", do you? That's just a scare tactic to feed more of your tax money to the military industrial complex.

Re: Russian troops use Starlink licensed and imported from Dubai

#278

Post by lispm »

khzw8yyy wrote: post #277
lispm wrote: post #269

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> This one was actually heard by a sizable audience? So, the content is the same? An aggressor trying to justify his aggression by his version of history? > The Russian take is: look, Crimea changes hands once every 100 or so years, and this is just the latest iteration. Putin was not going after Crimea, he was going to "free" the whole Ukraine in a few days (the "special operation") and then beyond. That's what he s…

Come on, you don't actually believe in "and beyond", do you? That's just a scare tactic to feed more of your tax money to the military industrial complex.

Putin? Don't be naive. He is the "protector" of every Russian (or what he thinks is a Russian). Like Crimea, he will start with regions where people will russian background live.

If he has the opportunity, than he invades neighbour countries. Why do you think Finland is a NATO member now and Sweden is seeking NATO membership? It was clear to them that they would be easy and early targets for conflicts, if they were not in a more powerful union.

Other countries he would start a conflict with, are countries which are looking to be members of the EU.

Putin just said in the interview that he won't invade Poland, only when Poland attacks Russia. Just like he said before that he won't invade Ukraine, but then he had to, to defend Russia from the West (and then did not call it war, but "special operation).

Putin dreams of a larger Russia and he as said that the real enemy is the "west", which he now sees as weak, especially when Trump is President again and Trump and his republican party won't defend Europe.

Poland and Estland would be the first targets. It might not start with a war, but Putin also did start to destabilize the Ukraine long before the current war. The interviewer is a tool, just like Trump.

Putin's Russia is an imperialistic terror state.

Re: Russian troops use Starlink licensed and imported from Dubai

#279

Post by mopsi »

somenameforme wrote: post #274
mopsi wrote: post #266

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> such a law obviously does not prevent people from using or learning their ethnic language It is only one measure of many that is driving the rapid decline of indigenous peoples in Russia. Russia has a long history of methodical persecution of indigenous peoples with a wide arsenal that spans from closure of schools and suppression of media to made up charges about "extremism" and being a "foreign agent" to punitive…

My friend, what you're doing here is called gish galloping. [1] Pick something you find truly compelling and stick with it. A lot of the things you're saying are poorly supported, misleading, or probably plainly false. And FWIW I'm not saying you're doing this intentionally. "We" have been in an information warfare mode for the past 2 years, and the truth is only just recently starting to come out of this mess. We pr…

> what you're doing here is called gish galloping.

It wasn't me who changed the topic from blaming Poland for Hitler's invasion, to denial of the well-known persecution of indigenous peoples in Russia, to calling international human rights organizations weapons against the glorious Russian motherland. Denial of mistreatment of indigenous peoples is particularly nasty, because it has been a cornerstone of dissident Russian human rights and environmentalist movements for a very long time. Indigenous peoples inhabit many Russian regions rich in natural resources and they have seen persecution not only in the form of suppression of their language and culture, but also in the form of physical destruction of their native land through mismanaged and inefficient resource extraction that leaves behind toxic wastelands. "We don't want to live in moonscapes," as one activist put it: https://www.aljazeera.com/features/2022/1/23/in-russia-indig...

Would you prefer to return to how Hitler only wanted Danzig and other Nazi myths? For some unknown reason they are very widespread in Russia and have strong foothold among boomers like Putin.

Re: Russian troops use Starlink licensed and imported from Dubai

#280

Post by _heimdall »

tjpnz wrote: post #251
_heimdall wrote: post #202

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Is it fair to assume Musk and any state actors he could be working with don't have any way to decrypt Russian encryption techniques? My only point is they its interesting how quick many are to jump on this a narrative that Elon is evil, he works for or with the Russians, etc when there is actually a scenario that fits in which he is closer to playing a role akin to Allan Turing during WWII.

You're doing Turing a great disservice comparing him to Musk.

I was comparing a potential scenario in which Muak found himself in much the same situation as Turing, I'm not comparing the men or their character at all.

I'm definitely not trying to compare what both men were/are put through. A sea of internet trolls complaining about how terrible a person they believe Musk to be is nothing compared to chemical castration and being convicted of gross indecency for what one chooses to do behind closed doors.

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