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Pakistan cuts off phone and internet services on election day

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Re: Pakistan cuts off phone and internet services on election day

#51

Post by lainga »

wozniacki wrote: post #39
TriNetra wrote: post #15

Earlier quoted context omitted.

IN Pakistan army decides and is the real ruler. Elections are only a face to appear as a democratic sate. In fact Pakistan elite (including army higher ranks) just is there to milk the country and build estates outside (West/UAE/etc).

Isnt it also true that no democratically elected or coup-installed Prime Minister in Pakistan's history has ever successfully completed a single full term in office, ever since their independence[1]? And if that is true, isn't Pakistan a glorified tin-pot republic, thats democracy only on paper & manages to stay alive at the mercy of the propping-up prowess of U.S. and U.K., to act as a lily pad[2] of sorts in the re…

Funny way to express the $65 billion of FDI that China's put into Pakistan, along with joint development of the JF-17 and 47% of China's arms exports as a whole, isn't it?

Or has the near-total cut in US military aid to Pakistan over 2018-2022 been a delayed coup de grace, and should we expect the country to implode at any minute?

Re: Pakistan cuts off phone and internet services on election day

#52

Post by 082349872349872 »

boeingUH60 wrote: post #21

Pakistan is a sad tale. A country of 200 million+ with almost no future. The elites are busy milking what’s left of the country before it flames out. The idiotic IMF continues giving them loans to support the extremely corrupt system..the US government also supports the extremely corrupt military. This is what happens when corruption is built into the culture of your society and religious/tribal hullabaloo is more pr…

Just wait until the elites figure out they can also milk China for port access that doesn't require transiting the south china sea?

Re: Pakistan cuts off phone and internet services on election day

#53

Post by mikrl »

hiAndrewQuinn wrote: post #22
stratocumulus0 wrote: post #20

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Some countries including my home country Poland impose a ban on political agitation on the election day. It means that no political content may be published on that day, but whatever has been published before that is allowed to stay. This is an old law which predates the Internet, so anything from social media posts to hanging up election posters is liable to be prosecuted and the authorities frequently do so. It's l…

Wait, do Polish people not consider themselves part of the West? Genuine question. I've met and worked with quite a few Poles since moving to the EU and my current takeaway is that it's in a really interesting fusion time between West, East, and some more mysterious third thing.

Historically, Poland was both and is a transition region between central and Eastern Europe.

Even when Poland was conquered, it was still the interface between a central/western empire (Reich Germany) an eastern empire (Russia) and an in-between empire (Austria-Hungary) but I would certainly call a city like Białystok ‘eastern’, but not necessarily Warsaw, Krakow or Wrocław.

The trouble is that what counts as ‘Eastern’ Europe can be demarcated by several large historical events (Mongols, flavour of Christianity, Communism, etc) so a definitive answer is hard to give.

Re: Pakistan cuts off phone and internet services on election day

#54

Post by nonrandomstring »

avgcorrection wrote: post #23
nonrandomstring wrote: post #3

Earlier quoted context omitted.

As an idea, media moratoriums immediately prior to elections seems fairly sensible. AI and disinformation attacks are likely to be 'last minute'. Maybe the entire phone and Internet system is going a bit far. Also, obtaining broad consensus for just muting the main social media channels doesn't seem that unreasonable. My thought is, unless gunmen are showing up at polling stations, what exactly is so urgent to discus…

On the one hand, maybe. On the other hand you lose democracy “bragging rights” when you have to protect the soft skulls of your subjects.

Yes there's some of loss of the sense of absolute democratic purity. But then Aristotle saw that tradeoff against real polity quite some time back.

I think your point (that people ought to be smart and strong enough to withstand all and any malign influence(?)) made a lot more sense 20 years ago. In the Internet and AI influence age I think things have significantly changed. It's the integrity of the democratic process rather than the "soft skills" that requires a little more protection.

Re: Pakistan cuts off phone and internet services on election day

#55

Post by RetpolineDrama »

renewiltord wrote: post #48
H8crilA wrote: post #40

The craziest thing is that Pakistan has nuclear weapons. And not only that, the weapons are at the disposal of the local (very high ranking) commanders. It also is a country where the military is really in charge, only occasionally giving back the control to a civilian government. Sometimes people think that Eastern Europe is the most likely place to get nuked, or perhaps some American carrier off the coast of China.…

Well, one of those two countries has a no-first-use nuclear doctrine, so I imagine there's a probability conditional there.

Russia has a lot of unacknowledged "lost" soviet-era nukes that are actually still in its control.

I could see them detonating one in India/Pakistan as a false flag to try and kick off a broader exchange to distract the West from Ukraine.

Re: Pakistan cuts off phone and internet services on election day

#56

Post by seatac76 »

RetpolineDrama wrote: post #55
renewiltord wrote: post #48

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Well, one of those two countries has a no-first-use nuclear doctrine, so I imagine there's a probability conditional there.

Russia has a lot of unacknowledged "lost" soviet-era nukes that are actually still in its control. I could see them detonating one in India/Pakistan as a false flag to try and kick off a broader exchange to distract the West from Ukraine.

What an insane conspiracy. They already invaded Ukraine what more distraction could they need.

Re: Pakistan cuts off phone and internet services on election day

#57

Post by yumraj »

boeingUH60 wrote: post #21

Pakistan is a sad tale. A country of 200 million+ with almost no future. The elites are busy milking what’s left of the country before it flames out. The idiotic IMF continues giving them loans to support the extremely corrupt system..the US government also supports the extremely corrupt military. This is what happens when corruption is built into the culture of your society and religious/tribal hullabaloo is more pr…

> A country of 200 million+ with almost no future.

It has great future, as China's vassal state.

Re: Pakistan cuts off phone and internet services on election day

#58

Post by KptMarchewa »

nonrandomstring wrote: post #24
stratocumulus0 wrote: post #20

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Some countries including my home country Poland impose a ban on political agitation on the election day. It means that no political content may be published on that day, but whatever has been published before that is allowed to stay. This is an old law which predates the Internet, so anything from social media posts to hanging up election posters is liable to be prosecuted and the authorities frequently do so. It's l…

Genuinely very curious what you (and more generally other Poles) think of that? Also is it effective (of course you have no control case for comparison)? Thanks.

People go around it by sharing "vegetable prices" on Twitter. It's not very effective, but at least prevents stunts outside voting places.

Re: Pakistan cuts off phone and internet services on election day

#59

Post by dageshi »

pphysch wrote: post #12
sofixa wrote: post #2

On one hand, this is a classic dictatorship move. Senegal just did the same just after postponing elections. On the other hand, Pakistan really did have terrorist attacks just before the election, targeted at the election. So taking heavy handed steps to protect the election integrity can be explained.

How does cutting off communications prevent terrorist cells from executing their planned attacks? The real reason is obviously that the ruling elite usurped and imprisoned Pakistan's most popular leader, which means the political situation is very volatile.

Bombs with mobile phones attached designed to trigger when the phone is called/texted?

Re: Pakistan cuts off phone and internet services on election day

#60

Post by avgcorrection »

nonrandomstring wrote: post #54
avgcorrection wrote: post #23

Earlier quoted context omitted.

On the one hand, maybe. On the other hand you lose democracy “bragging rights” when you have to protect the soft skulls of your subjects.

Yes there's some of loss of the sense of absolute democratic purity. But then Aristotle saw that tradeoff against real polity quite some time back. I think your point (that people ought to be smart and strong enough to withstand all and any malign influence(?)) made a lot more sense 20 years ago. In the Internet and AI influence age I think things have significantly changed. It's the integrity of the democratic proce…

“Disinformation” is always a smokescreen. All nominal (keyword) democratic processes are filled with disinformation: standard advertisement. Those who want peace, lay down your own arms as well (no takers).

Like almost 2 years of election circus in the US federal election.

> I think your point (that people ought to be smart and strong enough to withstand all and any malign influence(?))

That’s absurd. I don’t conceptualize “people” as some not-me group.

Well I’m not Indian^W Pakistani but the principle is universal.

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