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How to hire low experience, high potential people

worktopia.substack.com

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Re: How to hire low experience, high potential people

#381

Post by PeterStuer »

CharlieDigital wrote: post #54
smeeth wrote: post #41

People's intuitions around hiring aren't Bayesian enough. I think a good process reduces down to something like: - Are they smart? (understands quickly + communicates effectively) - Are they cool? (won't put poison in the keurig + pleasant to be around) - Are they high energy? (initiative + action bias) - Do they have the experience needed to be successful in the role? Those are pretty strong priors for success. If y…

I have a 4-quardrant way of thinking about this that's similar. - Y-axis is "drive" - X-axis is "aptitude" - low drive + low aptitude: never hire - low drive + high aptitude: hire for targeted use cases where you need expertise - high drive + low aptitude: hire, train, and foster aptitude growth - high drive + high aptitude: hire on the spot There's an indirect way of testing for this which is to test for curiosity a…

I'd go with the crazy/hot axis myself.

You meet minimum requirements on both, and if you do your contribution better exceed your high maintainance demands.

Re: How to hire low experience, high potential people

#382

Post by harperlee »

conro1108 wrote: post #261
walthamstow wrote: post #127

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Aren't these quadrants from about 100 years ago? Some Prussian General von Whatshisname? Edit: General von Hammerstein I divide my officers into four classes as follows: the clever, the industrious, the lazy, and the stupid. Those who are clever and industrious I appoint to the General Staff. Use can under certain circumstances be made of those who are stupid and lazy. The man who is clever and lazy qualifies for the…

It's a similar shape but with quite different conclusions - low drive + low aptitude: never hire Hammerstein thinks some use can be made of these folks - low drive + high aptitude: hire for targeted use cases where you need expertise Hammerstein has this group as high leadership positions - high drive + low aptitude: hire, train, and foster aptitude growth These are the ones who Hammerstein avoids - high drive + high…

At the risk of sounding like a LinkedIn post, it seems clear that the difference between General von Hammerstein and CharlieDigital is whether they have a fixed vs. growth mindset about their potential team.

Re: How to hire low experience, high potential people

#383

Post by swifthesitation »

i_h8_lc_grind wrote: post #291
tptacek wrote: post #179

We built Fly.io resume-blind and without interviews, hiring people at every level of experience without having to make decisions based on that experience. We did it by throwing away all this stuff, ditching interviews, and replacing them with work-sample tests. Some of the best people on our team, the best I've worked with in my whole career, are working here in their first job in our field. I'm a little grumpy about…

This is good to know. I think a lot of people are tired of wasting their lifespan on grinding lc-medium/hards. Is there a website with a list of companies that don't participate in the leetcode/FAANG interview process? I feel like there is a need for one.

https://github.com/poteto/hiring-without-whiteboards

Re: How to hire low experience, high potential people

#384

Post by SilverBirch »

thih9 wrote: post #35

> I really like questions with maximalist qualifiers like "tell me about your best X.” If it's not good, you know that their best isn't good enough. Note that this approach, when not supplemented by other questions, favors outlier great results over consistent good results. E.g.: Distribution A: 3, 2, 3, 2, 2, 1, 100, 2, 1, 3; MAX(A) = 100 Distribution B: 72, 73, 78, 79, 44, 75, 78, 79, 78, 79; MAX(B) = 79

To just chime in, it also massively incentivizes liars, bullshitters and people who are straight up delusional.

Re: How to hire low experience, high potential people

#385

Post by SilverBirch »

It's always funny to see the embedded "unconventional" theme come up again and again. Hot take: You don't need someone unconventional. You need someone good. Unconventional people are just the people you notice because they're outliers, and now rather than looking for what you need - which is someone good, you're looking for this other thing. This is particularly funny of course because this person spent 6 years working at Stripe, a company founded by a genius techie who went to MIT, dropped out, joined YC sold a company for a few million. Started a new business - Stripe, and got a load of funding from Peter Thiel. His path through life could not have been a more conventional story for a tech CEO.

So you tell me, should I be hiring you - the diamond in the rough unconventional middle manager at stripe. Or should I be hiring the absolutely conventional genius who built a billion dollar business.

Please, explain to me, what is it about being conventional that disqualifies someone?

Re: How to hire low experience, high potential people

#386

Post by tasubotadas »

tptacek wrote: post #352
tasubotadas wrote: post #344

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Could you give some exercise examples? How complex do you make? Does it feel like doing work for you?

It feels like what working here feels like, but it is strictly not doing work "for" us.

How different are the take home exercises from the workday?

Re: How to hire low experience, high potential people

#387

Post by reportgunner »

noamchomsky1 wrote: post #6

> “Tell me about you. If your life was a book, give me the chapter titles from your birth till now.” Utterly ridiculous.

I'm getting red flags from this guide. "Tell me about your best X" is a very low effort question. Being excited about digging through person's life like it's an open book and even excited about them explaining how they cared of their dying parent is perverted at best.

Re: How to hire low experience, high potential people

#389

Post by firstplacelast »

gwbas1c wrote: post #348
tptacek wrote: post #179

We built Fly.io resume-blind and without interviews, hiring people at every level of experience without having to make decisions based on that experience. We did it by throwing away all this stuff, ditching interviews, and replacing them with work-sample tests. Some of the best people on our team, the best I've worked with in my whole career, are working here in their first job in our field. I'm a little grumpy about…

Just remember that all interview techniques have bias; what works well for one company / role may not work well for your company / role. That being said, it sounds like your interview technique works well for you.

I started an interview at fly like 1.5 years ago.

Figured I’d give it a shot, they were very responsive, gave me the challenge and I spent more time than was suggested. They had a few core technologies I was not familiar with at all, but figured I could hack it…I could not.

Anyway, I really appreciated it. Walked away with nothing but positive feelings.

I have spent enough time applying/interviewing over the last decade that I am often in a dilemma when I get an offer that I don’t want bc the process is so fucky/I already have negative feelings. From HR setting expectations and then not meeting them, the laid-out interview process not lining up, remote/hybrid changing, inability to describe actual projects I would work on, not meeting people I would work under/with, made to feel like I lack intelligence by interviewers, etc.

I’m not a “rockstar” programmer and never have tons of offers, but I have turned down offers because of screwy interview processes/interviewers just to stay at the evil I know.

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