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DEF CON 32 Was Canceled. We Un-Canceled it

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Re: DEF CON 32 Was Canceled. We Un-Canceled it

#91

Post by colecut »

shadowgovt wrote: post #45
taywrobel wrote: post #40

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Without robust and easily scaled infrastructure in place ahead of time, an organic DDOS is one of the most difficult situations to mitigate. Not much can be done in terms of traffic shaping, rate limiting, or bot detection.

Of course, a robust and easily-scaled infrastructure is pretty easy to rent these days... ... if you're willing to trust another company with your data.

I would trust just about any company with information that I want to be available to the public

Re: DEF CON 32 Was Canceled. We Un-Canceled it

#93

Post by Kirby64 »

daveguy wrote: post #48
smt88 wrote: post #37

Earlier quoted context omitted.

My first thought was that GP was saying DefCon attendees would be counting cards, which is an effective and legal way to beat the house[1] (until you're caught and banned from the casino). 1. https://www.freep.com/story/entertainment/nightlife/2016/04/...

Casinos in Vegas use too many decks and reshuffle frequently enough that there is no edge gained over the house when card counting.

This is not true. Besides continuous shuffler machines, most casinos have 6 or 8 deck games that have plenty of 'penetration' (card counter term for depth into the deck that the cut card is placed) to offer an edge if you properly card count. There's also a big game to be played where rubes think they can card count and instead lose tons of money attempting to do so.

The problem with card counting generally is that the casino has infinite money and never runs out, thereby they can sustain large expected value swings... whereas you need an enormous bankroll to handle those swings, assuming they don't throw you out before that happens.

Re: DEF CON 32 Was Canceled. We Un-Canceled it

#95

Post by verandaguy »

PedroBatista wrote: post #13

Not a fan of what DEF CON has become in the last years, so I selfishly hope it somehow "goes away" and reborn in a more technical and actual hacker note. Too many "security researchers", "staff engineers" and people playing politics. But I suspect they will have no problem finding another venue, sponsor money has been flowing quite well, so I wish them well.

I don't have a ton of love for politicking, but security researchers and staff engineers, a lot of the time, are people who either have a career in a really interesting area in infosec and can bring a lot to the table as teachers/presenters, or people who want to get into that area and who'd benefit massively from a place like DEF CON considering how accessible its talks, demos, and villages are to people of all skill levels.

Socialising, learning hacking history, and getting to know the traditions is always a great side effect that the DC crowd's been good at passing on to new generations. Goons still give people shit for misbehaving, speakers still take shots, TOOOL still has some of the best workshops and tutorials on the conference floor and usually has some people who'll talk about breaking open Medecos or Fichets to anyone who'll listen.

I'd venture to say it's against the spirit of the con to try and gatekeep it.

Having said all that (and the irony not being lost on me) -- linecon's definitely getting worse, and I'm worried that DC's becoming a victim of its own success, with its accessible pricing and subject matter being counterbalanced by having to manage a 20-30k person crowd. I don't have a solution for this outside of decentralization, but I don't know if that's a good solution.

Re: DEF CON 32 Was Canceled. We Un-Canceled it

#96

Post by paxys »

tptacek wrote: post #83
caymanjim wrote: post #14

I find it hilarious that defcon.org can't handle the traffic from being on HN.

Why would you expect them to be that kind of resilient? It's just a conference brochure site.

> It's just a conference brochure site.

That’s exactly why it should be resilient. A fully static text-heavy site can serve basically unlimited traffic on a free host or a $5 VPS these days.

Re: DEF CON 32 Was Canceled. We Un-Canceled it

#97

Post by weinzierl »

mrandish wrote: post #4

I suspect Caesar's dropped DEF CON because the DEF CON attendees likely have a fairly low "avg revenue per attendee" yield because fewer of them gamble compared to the avg Vegas conference attendee. They also probably spend less on high-end restaurant dining and bar drinking inside the hotel. Since the pandemic Vegas has had a pretty strong resurgence in general and this may be a sign that Caesar's is doing well enou…

"I suspect Caesar's dropped DEF CON because the DEF CON attendees likely have a fairly low "avg revenue per attendee" yield because fewer of them gamble compared to the avg Vegas conference attendee."

There is the story that the American Physical Society was not allowed back after in 1986 Vegas supposedly suffered its worst week in history.

First of all there is no real evidence that this story is true and secondly it doesn't make sense to me that they would cancel DEF CON after so many years for that reason. They would have done so much earlier, probably.

https://skeptics.stackexchange.com/questions/39668/did-a-cas...

Re: DEF CON 32 Was Canceled. We Un-Canceled it

#98

Post by metabagel »

p-e-w wrote: post #18
mrandish wrote: post #4

I suspect Caesar's dropped DEF CON because the DEF CON attendees likely have a fairly low "avg revenue per attendee" yield because fewer of them gamble compared to the avg Vegas conference attendee. They also probably spend less on high-end restaurant dining and bar drinking inside the hotel. Since the pandemic Vegas has had a pretty strong resurgence in general and this may be a sign that Caesar's is doing well enou…

The simplest explanation is often the correct one. Casinos aren't exactly known for having moral qualms. They are, however, known for caring about their bottom line. They probably analyze every single event they host and then shuffle things around to maximize their expected revenue based on their past experiences with the same type of event.

Put another way, they got a better offer

Re: DEF CON 32 Was Canceled. We Un-Canceled it

#99

Post by p-e-w »

nodesocket wrote: post #25
mrandish wrote: post #4

I suspect Caesar's dropped DEF CON because the DEF CON attendees likely have a fairly low "avg revenue per attendee" yield because fewer of them gamble compared to the avg Vegas conference attendee. They also probably spend less on high-end restaurant dining and bar drinking inside the hotel. Since the pandemic Vegas has had a pretty strong resurgence in general and this may be a sign that Caesar's is doing well enou…

Doubtful, I'm sure it's related to the constant attacks against their infrastructure they must defend against (let's be honest, I'm sure Caesars is not defending successfully). The juice just ain't worth the squeeze. They have a business to run, and the risk of having a bunch of drunken and high hackers who happen to be the best in the world running amuck is not their idea of a good corporate event.

> the constant attacks against their infrastructure they must defend against (let's be honest, I'm sure Caesars is not defending successfully)

If there's any place in the private sector where I'd expect security (including digital security) to be literally top notch, a casino would be it.

And casinos don't fuck around. If they catch some "uber haxor" laying a finger on their networks, you can bet they'd have him arrested in a heartbeat, regardless of whether he is a conference attendee or not.

Re: DEF CON 32 Was Canceled. We Un-Canceled it

#100

Post by cududa »

sircastor wrote: post #64
tkems wrote: post #8

I find this strange but not surprising. I've heard of speed bumps in the past related to 'hackers in town' and I wouldn't be surprised if it comes out later that it had something to do with it, even if unfounded. I think overall, having that many 'hackers' in town makes people overly paranoid. I wonder if the ransomware incident last year played a role in this decision? [0] I'm guessing they wouldn't announce it for…

> I wonder if the ransomware incident last year played a role in this decision? This makes more sense to me than the other explanations. Probably coupled with an underinformed general manager or company president.

That’s probably not even tin foil hat-y.

I’d wager a bet that the perpetrators of the hack had visited Cesar’s during defcon

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