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Ofsted inspectors 'make up evidence' about a school's performance when IT fails

theguardian.com

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Re: Ofsted inspectors 'make up evidence' about a school's performance when IT fails

#21

Post by tailspin2019 »

oogali wrote: post #4
DicIfTEx wrote: post #2

For context, Ofsted is the much-maligned government inspectorate of schools in England. They are currently under increased scrutiny following an inquest into the suicide of a headteacher following an inspection that concluded at the end of last year: https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/education-67639942 and https://www.bbc.com/news/education-67639943

I hope people think more about cases like this and the Post Office when they go to say “it’s not like we’re curing cancer” or “my bad code isn’t a matter of life or death”. You might be far removed from the implications of doing a poor job but that doesn’t mean everyone else is.

While I do agree in principle, I think it's also the case that "the software" has been used as a convenient scapegoat and cover for what were incredibly poor practices and dishonest, irresponsible conduct.

The fact that software is involved is in some ways a side issue - and while I do agree we as techies do need to consider the responsibility that we have, I'm equally frustrated how the narrative in the Post Office case has been deliberately shifted towards "it was because the software had bugs" as opposed to "multiple people in charge were deliberately deceitful and behaved completely reprehensibly".

This is borne out by the UK government's attempted shift of all the responsibility on to Fujitsu in the Post Office case (who are absolutely not blameless) while trying to push attention away from the Post Office's - and by extension the government's - own considerable culpability.

I'm sure they'll seek to do the same in this Ofsted situation.

Re: Ofsted inspectors 'make up evidence' about a school's performance when IT fails

#22

Post by adroniser »

tailspin2019 wrote: post #21
oogali wrote: post #4

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I hope people think more about cases like this and the Post Office when they go to say “it’s not like we’re curing cancer” or “my bad code isn’t a matter of life or death”. You might be far removed from the implications of doing a poor job but that doesn’t mean everyone else is.

While I do agree in principle, I think it's also the case that "the software" has been used as a convenient scapegoat and cover for what were incredibly poor practices and dishonest, irresponsible conduct. The fact that software is involved is in some ways a side issue - and while I do agree we as techies do need to consider the responsibility that we have, I'm equally frustrated how the narrative in the Post Office…

Absolutely. As far as I know both Fujitsu and the Post Office were aware of the bugs in the system, and deliberately covered them up.

Re: Ofsted inspectors 'make up evidence' about a school's performance when IT fails

#23

Post by nonrandomstring »

DicIfTEx wrote: post #2

For context, Ofsted is the much-maligned government inspectorate of schools in England. They are currently under increased scrutiny following an inquest into the suicide of a headteacher following an inspection that concluded at the end of last year: https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/education-67639942 and https://www.bbc.com/news/education-67639943

Both the Post-Office/Horizon and OFSTED scandals involve blind deference to unfit technology that have led to deaths. We have been covering these on cybershow.uk with three hour long episodes in the pipeline for release soon. If any HN readers are in the UK and worked for Post Office, OFSTED or at a school and want to contribute insights do please get in touch.

Re: Ofsted inspectors 'make up evidence' about a school's performance when IT fails

#24

Post by nonrandomstring »

vdaea wrote: post #8
DicIfTEx wrote: post #2

For context, Ofsted is the much-maligned government inspectorate of schools in England. They are currently under increased scrutiny following an inquest into the suicide of a headteacher following an inspection that concluded at the end of last year: https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/education-67639942 and https://www.bbc.com/news/education-67639943

What is that first link saying? That teachers need LESS oversight? This must be a joke. Also what does software have to do with that case?

> teachers need LESS oversight?

They absolutely do. In fact they're going on strike in the UK over intolerable working conditions, and while the MSM report this as ostensibly about "pay" the deeper reason is that they are micro-managed to hell.

Re: Ofsted inspectors 'make up evidence' about a school's performance when IT fails

#25

Post by gadders »

DicIfTEx wrote: post #2

For context, Ofsted is the much-maligned government inspectorate of schools in England. They are currently under increased scrutiny following an inquest into the suicide of a headteacher following an inspection that concluded at the end of last year: https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/education-67639942 and https://www.bbc.com/news/education-67639943

>>much maligned

Yes, by teachers and their unions. Parents generally like it and choose schools based on its ratings which are generally credible.

Re: Ofsted inspectors 'make up evidence' about a school's performance when IT fails

#26

Post by gadders »

vdaea wrote: post #8
DicIfTEx wrote: post #2

For context, Ofsted is the much-maligned government inspectorate of schools in England. They are currently under increased scrutiny following an inquest into the suicide of a headteacher following an inspection that concluded at the end of last year: https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/education-67639942 and https://www.bbc.com/news/education-67639943

What is that first link saying? That teachers need LESS oversight? This must be a joke. Also what does software have to do with that case?

They're state employees. That's not how things work in the public sector.

I mean we all get OKRs, objectives etc but government employees are a special case.

Re: Ofsted inspectors 'make up evidence' about a school's performance when IT fails

#27

Post by graemep »

oxfordmale wrote: post #6

How often does their IT fail? Outsourced to Crapita or Fooljitsu by any chance? With Google Docs/Office 365 the last time I lost a full document is years ago now. I am old enough to have stored my laptop in the fridge when writing my PhD thesis, to keep the fault rate down. However, that is when hard drives where still mechanical, and online backups not a common thing.

I do not know about education, but there are rules for medical data. For example, with the NHS you have to use approved cloud providers and the medical data has to be stored in the UK.

There is also might be functionality that is not part of Google Docs in terms of metadata on notes, who information is searchable etc.

Re: Ofsted inspectors 'make up evidence' about a school's performance when IT fails

#28

Post by blowski »

gadders wrote: post #25
DicIfTEx wrote: post #2

For context, Ofsted is the much-maligned government inspectorate of schools in England. They are currently under increased scrutiny following an inquest into the suicide of a headteacher following an inspection that concluded at the end of last year: https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/education-67639942 and https://www.bbc.com/news/education-67639943

>>much maligned Yes, by teachers and their unions. Parents generally like it and choose schools based on its ratings which are generally credible.

Liked by parents before their kids get into the school, often detested after publishing a report that doesn’t match their own experience. I’ve personally seen them make weird recommendations that damaged the school.

Re: Ofsted inspectors 'make up evidence' about a school's performance when IT fails

#29

Post by graemep »

tailspin2019 wrote: post #21
oogali wrote: post #4

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I hope people think more about cases like this and the Post Office when they go to say “it’s not like we’re curing cancer” or “my bad code isn’t a matter of life or death”. You might be far removed from the implications of doing a poor job but that doesn’t mean everyone else is.

While I do agree in principle, I think it's also the case that "the software" has been used as a convenient scapegoat and cover for what were incredibly poor practices and dishonest, irresponsible conduct. The fact that software is involved is in some ways a side issue - and while I do agree we as techies do need to consider the responsibility that we have, I'm equally frustrated how the narrative in the Post Office…

and the government were told the system was likely to be unreliable before they even bought it:

https://www.telegraph.co.uk/politics/2024/01/26/sir-geoff-mu...

The whole thing was a shambles and there was no scrutiny from the start.

Re: Ofsted inspectors 'make up evidence' about a school's performance when IT fails

#30

Post by IshKebab »

oogali wrote: post #4
DicIfTEx wrote: post #2

For context, Ofsted is the much-maligned government inspectorate of schools in England. They are currently under increased scrutiny following an inquest into the suicide of a headteacher following an inspection that concluded at the end of last year: https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/education-67639942 and https://www.bbc.com/news/education-67639943

I hope people think more about cases like this and the Post Office when they go to say “it’s not like we’re curing cancer” or “my bad code isn’t a matter of life or death”. You might be far removed from the implications of doing a poor job but that doesn’t mean everyone else is.

While it's obviously better for bugs to not happen, the issue here is that both Ofsted and the Post Office covered up the existence of the bugs, lied about it and didn't fix them.

If they'd been like "oh, a bug. We'll fix it" then there would be no issue.

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